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saberrider

public eating prohibited during Ramadan

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We have it here in Pakistan. Some people are not capable of fasting. Especially in the heat. Period. I feel it is harsh. Is this Islamic ? Is this allowed in Islam ?

Edited by saberrider

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Harsh? It is beyond belief and reflective of a hypocritical society. These champions of Islam who beat up minorities for eating in private or public in the month of Ramzan are the ones who go crazy after hearing about ban on face covering in France or ban on beef in India. Their fast is a huge favour on humanity which is why they react violently at anyone who offends them. 

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2 hours ago, Abbas. said:

It is beyond belief and reflective of a hypocritical society.

If someone cannot or would not fast, so it's his & her decision and it's no one'e business but eating in public in a country with majority of Muslims is something else. so Islamic states can prohibit eating in public. (I'm not talking about some harsh videos that goes viral these days about police in Pakistan!)

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6 minutes ago, alabegh said:

If someone cannot or would not fast, so it's his & her decision and it's no one'e business but eating in public in a country with majority of Muslims is something else. so Islamic states can prohibit eating in public. 

..... and going by the same rule non Islamic states can prohibit covering face or head in public, right??? 

 

@saberrider Kis baat ki tension he aapko? Yahan per aaj tak kabhi koi rule, koi law implement hua he? 

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1 hour ago, starlight said:

..... and going by the same rule non Islamic states can prohibit covering face or head in public, right??? 

 

@saberrider Kis baat ki tension he aapko? Yahan per aaj tak kabhi koi rule, koi law implement hua he? 

No i'm not talking about non-Muslims. i said for any Muslims that lives in a country with majority of Muslims who respect the Ramadan it's not OK to walks out and bites McDonald's sandwich.

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30 minutes ago, alabegh said:

No i'm not talking about non-Muslims. i said for any Muslims that lives in a country with majority of Muslims who respect the Ramadan it's not OK to walks out and bites McDonald's sandwich.

The laws usually applies to the whole population, which is what the OP is talking about. A law saying Muslims can't eat in public but non Muslim can sounds a but impractical.  

I am going to be travelling tomorrow, for work... It will take me the whole day and I will be definitely be drinking water in public...... and if I get too hungry I will probably eat something too. 

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It's bad manners to enjoy food in front of people who are fasting, but to make it illegal is too much. If a person is excused from or unable to fast, do they have to stay home? 

Are there also laws mandating holding the door for the person coming in behind you? How about a law forbidding chewing noisily? Better yet, there should be a law forbidding public staring at anyone for any reason. 

 

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In Iran there are Laws against eating in public during Shahr Ramadhan. I assume they are punished through ta'zir.

According to Sayyed al-Khoei ANY sin can be punishable by ta'zir.

1 hour ago, starlight said:

..... and going by the same rule non Islamic states can prohibit covering face or head in public, right??? 

So if other countries don't rule by God's Law, we shouldn't? Why should we care about what other nations do? They can do what they want.

The scholars say if any country stops you from practicing your religion properly, then leave.

Edited by The Batman

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1 hour ago, notme said:

It's bad manners to enjoy food in front of people who are fasting, but to make it illegal is too much. If a person is excused from or unable to fast, do they have to stay home? 

Are there also laws mandating holding the door for the person coming in behind you? How about a law forbidding chewing noisily? Better yet, there should be a law forbidding public staring at anyone for any reason. 

 

what about if it's a Islam's law? i'm not talking as a viewpoint of democracy but a'm talking as Islam's point of view. we have Narrations clarify that everyone eat and not fast in Ramadan and others see that would be punished. wasā'il al-shia vol 7 page 179

Edited by alabegh

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35 minutes ago, alabegh said:

what about if it's a Islam's law? i'm not talking as a viewpoint of democracy but a'm talking as Islam's point of view. we have Narrations clarify that everyone eat and not fast in Ramadan and others see that would be punished. wasā'il al-shia vol 7 page 179

I've never studied rulings on this, because I live in a secular country so it's never been an issue in my life, but I hate the idea of elderly or ill or travelling people being abused or ostracised for taking care of their health by eating during Ramadan daytime. If I see a Muslim not fasting during Ramadan, I assume they have their reasons and I leave it between them and Allah. Everybody's business is not my business, nor is everybody's business the government's business.

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1 hour ago, notme said:

I've never studied rulings on this, because I live in a secular country so it's never been an issue in my life, but I hate the idea of elderly or ill or travelling people being abused or ostracised for taking care of their health by eating during Ramadan daytime. If I see a Muslim not fasting during Ramadan, I assume they have their reasons and I leave it between them and Allah. Everybody's business is not my business, nor is everybody's business the government's business.

As i told before that "elderly or ill or travelling people" can eat in some privet place like home or restaurant and other place and what are you saying that "is not my business" is totally against one of the major principles in Islam "Enjoining good and forbidding wrong" that no one can deny. so we should tell that Muslim "please do not eat in public"

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21 minutes ago, alabegh said:

As i told before that "elderly or ill or travelling people" can eat in some privet place like home or restaurant and other place and what are you saying that "is not my business" is totally against one of the major principles in Islam "Enjoining good and forbidding wrong" that no one can deny. so we should tell that Muslim "please do not eat in public"

And a restaurant is not a public place?  

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So do they police breastfeeding mothers too? They also can't fast if they want to keep up milk production.

I have never heard of a law or hadith saying that people who have an excuse to not fast have to hide while they eat. 

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1 hour ago, The Batman said:

In Iran there are Laws against eating in public during Shahr Ramadhan. I assume they are punished through ta'zir.

According to Sayyed al-Khoei ANY sin can be punishable by ta'zir.

So if other countries don't rule by God's Law, we shouldn't? Why should we care about what other nations do? They can do what they want.

The scholars say if any country stops you from practicing your religion properly, then leave.

What do travellers do in Iran?  Or diabetic people or pregnant and breastfeeding mothers? Get confined to their homes??? How Islamic?  

Where did I say that we shouldn't abide by Allah's laws? Just a simple matter of realising that it's just Muslims who believe in Allah, Christians and Jews don't. 

So going by what you said, Muslim women instead of fighting the hijab ban in France should have just left the country and moved to an Islamic one. 

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1 hour ago, starlight said:

And a restaurant is not a public place?  

not that kind of public.even here in Iran restaurants are allowed to serve the traveling people and try to cover that. so the point is respect the Ramadan and Muslims.

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5 hours ago, saberrider said:

We have it here in Pakistan. Some people are not capable of fasting. Especially in the heat. Period. I feel it is harsh. Is this Islamic ? Is this allowed in Islam ?

It is Haram to eat during month of Ramadan without execuse

for those who have excuse , it is (makrooh?) to eat in public out of respect to the month.

2 wrongs do not make thing correct

If some are badly treating people during the month of Ramadan and disrespecting the muslims in a way that breaks the scantily of the month, protesting over the atrocity through eating in public isn't going to fix it

 

Those who are sick or have other excuses may turn to some corner away from street, in some room away from sight and eat. I think it is even better than getting nosey people asking you why are you not fasting, even f they were not aggressive.

A woman who get beaten badly for showing some hair shouldn't be a reason for other women to protest and take off their own hijab.. this just dose not fix it

 

 I am not sure what's happening in your country, but where I am, public places like restaurants and diners as well as parties and any "appearance" of food is avoided. Saying that, we offer the sick , the elderly and the kids food even in public. Especially the kids.

Elderly usually avoid to make a scene, but they need to eat to take their medicine so usually is done inside home.

If someone fell down or get dizzy due to thirst during ramadan, we offer them water as well and take them to other room.

It is just common sense.

I see people eating during ramadan. women who have excuses or kids or traveller.. but they do not tend to eat in streets. They do it in rooms .

anyways, as i said, I'm not sure what's the craze that's going on in pakistan currently . The best month of the year is being spit on it by all parties.

 

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14 minutes ago, alabegh said:

not that kind of public.even here in Iran restaurants are allowed to serve the traveling people and try to cover that. so the point is respect the Ramadan and Muslims.

Respecting the holy month of Ramadhan and Muslims is not making people who cannot fast feel ashamed of that. It is obedience to Allah when they eat and drink during the day. 

Edited by Siddiqah

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6 minutes ago, Siddiqah said:

Respecting the holy month of Ramadhan and Muslims is not making people who cannot fast feel ashamed that of that. It is obedience to Allah when they eat and drink during the day. 

salam

As i said, those with excuses do eat during ramadan but they avoid the sight as much as possible. It is the law.

What is breaking the law are those who badly treat those with excuses .. and those who should be educated but instead of making wise decisions , they protest by disrespecting the month

The protest should be against those who disrespect the month and harm the weak... The month itself is innocent and it shouldn't be spitted on.

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A law would be that "it is forbidden for people who cannot fast to eat in public". Where is that law? That is what I was asking. There is none. Meaning it isn't haram. Meaning these majority Muslim populated countries making laws against people who are unable to fast from eating in public is not in keeping with Islam. It might be prefered to not eat in public but when people are out and about, sometimes things can't be helped.

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46 minutes ago, starlight said:

What do travellers do in Iran?  Or diabetic people or pregnant and breastfeeding mothers? Get confined to their homes??? How Islamic?  

Where did I say that we shouldn't abide by Allah's laws? Just a simple matter of realising that it's just Muslims who believe in Allah, Christians and Jews don't. 

So going by what you said, Muslim women instead of fighting the hijab ban in France should have just left the country and moved to an Islamic one. 

I don't know how Iranian Law works, I don't live in Iran. All I know (or heard that) Iran punishes those who eat in public during the Blessed Month. As far as I have read, that is in line with what some scholars say. As far as excused people, I have no idea how their situation is dealt with, if you want to know perhaps get in touch with someone that lives in Iran, they know better, insha Allah.

If Muslim women can change the law in France, then they can try and change it. If it is of no avail, and it affects their religion, it is better to leave. Simple as that.

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6 minutes ago, Siddiqah said:

A law would be that "it is forbidden for people who cannot fast to eat in public". Where is that law? That is what I was asking. There is none. Meaning it isn't haram. Meaning these majority Muslim populated countries making laws against people who are unable to fast from eating in public is not in keeping with Islam. It might be prefered to not eat in public but when people are out and about, sometimes things can't be helped.

Do not go emotional XD

The laws are personal. If you ask your marj'e he will answer you. YOU may not show that you are not fasting during Ramadan as much as possible

This is the law and it is YOUR obligation. I am not talking about the STATE law in Pakstan. And i am not talking about those who speak against the STATE law of Pakistan... I m saying those who are going to show the food during the month although they can hide it and eat it are going against the scantily of the month XD 

It is really ancient law and people are living with it perfectly in islamic states.... i dont suppose you people can imagine it if you dont live it. Basically, all food outlets are closed during the day.. and you can hardly see anyone sitting in park on on sea front setting meal for him and his family or friends and eating, even if they are all travellers 

If by chance you come across someone who has to break his fast, we assume they are sick or otherwise .. and they tend to eat small bits, not a whole fatty meal , small gulps of water and something

Elderly , like my grandparents, we used to offer them their three daily meals, they were though inside our house XD

That's all about the law of not eating in public

If someone wants to go nuts and beat people who are eating during the day , then someone else wanna go nuts and eat shamelessly during the day of the month just to protest it 

well islam has nothing to do with both of these nuts XD 

aS notme said, it is a matter of manners and etiquette and that's what's the law is about.. do not show food and eat infant of those who are thirsty and hungry... not too much to ask, is it?

 

anyways, I'm off this nonsense topic

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There was no emotion in my statement, just bluntness and state of fact. In the U.S., I see people eating all the time while fasting, so it just doesn't bother me. That's why I wondered at countries making laws disallowing people from eating, if they couldn't fast.

 

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