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Is there any doubt left of Assads crimes?

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Salam

 @kirtc The same happend after 2009 presidential election in Iran, color revolution like Ukraine. BBC and VOA motivated people that election is corrupted and there is a huge cheat. So people rallied in streets for months (Green Movement).

Among these crowd some CIA/MUSAD/MI6 agents killed people and made martyr of them.So people got furious by blood.

A movie has produced about these agents : Golden Collars. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2339707/

 

 

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http://www.shiachat.com/forum/topic/235039041-top-10-heroes-of-your-country-in-100-years

 

 

Edited by Mahdi Mortezapour

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8 minutes ago, Mahdi Mortezapour said:

Salam

 @kirtc The same happend after 2009 presidential election in Iran, color revolution like Ukraine. BBC and VOA motivated people that election is corrupted and there is a huge cheat. So people rallied in streets for months (Green Movement).

Among these crown some CIA/MUSAD/MI6 agents killed people and made martyr of them.So people got furious by blood.

A movie has produced about these agents : Golden Collars. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2339707/

 

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://www.shiachat.com/forum/topic/235039041-top-10-heroes-of-your-country-in-100-years

 

 

Yes, I definitely believe it has happened time and time again. thanks for the movie. I will watch it

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Hello,

5 hours ago, kirtc said:

@Abu-Jafar Herz, @Tawheed313, @sharinganMahdi

David66 is an israeli jew and shouldn't be allowed to post on this site in my opinion.He will only spread misinformation and ignorance from his own.

 

 

Sorry to disappoint you but I am neither.  Just your average American citizen.  I spent 7 years in the United States Air Force and now I design industrial air pollution control equipment. 

I do find your reaction to views that differ from yours interesting.  But, if we all had the same opinion I think the World would be a pretty boring place.

And, thanks for the narrative regarding the start of the war in Syria.  I do not agree with it in total.  But, you have some interesting points.

All the Best,

David

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9 hours ago, David66 said:

Hello,

Maybe you did not read the reports carefully.  There is one source. Caesar, a code name given to a Syrian military photographer who defected with flash drives containing 55,000 photographs.  Maybe there would be more sources at this time but an authorization for a UN investigation was vetoed by Russia and China.  Could these be fakes or misrepresentations?  Anything is possible.  But, one thing is certain, these people suffered a terrible death.  And, one day in the future, because of these photos, their story will be told.

Abu-Jafar Herz asked for evidence against Bashar Al-Assad.  That has been provided.

All the Best,

David

That's their sources, eh? Hmmm, okay,  kind of skeptical already but like you said, anything is possible. I really don't like Bashar Assad and as much as I don't like him, I'll admit he is a stabilizing influence for now.  You think Assad is bad, try some of these groups fighting him. They will be even worse.

Remember, America has into a lot of messes, relying on single sources with code names.  Red flags were  waving  when the only thing for a source was some man called "Caesar". 

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7 hours ago, kirtc said:

@Abu-Jafar Herz, @Tawheed313, @sharinganMahdi

David66 is an israeli jew and shouldn't be allowed to post on this site in my opinion.He will only spread misinformation and ignorance from his own.

I think I have a very educated opinion on this matter and some insight few have, I ask you to hear me out.

In the early days of the "revolution" when it was just demonstrations and protests, it was extremely obvious that these people were being moved by an external force, and not acting on their own whim. Someone from outside orchestrated a movement with promises of a better life. 

Now I work in media, and daily I would watch these protests on tv, one thing I noticed is the banners the syrians would hold up had perfect English and grammar, and yes you can say anyone can write these, but it was obvious from the way they were written and the type of "universal language", that these banners were given to them to hold up. Syrians can't write English to save their lives. 

I live in Beirut, and in a predominantly sunni area. And I used to work for the Hariri (saudi-backed) corporation. In the early days when the protests were still peaceful, I met with a co-worker who informed me about how saudi "aid money" was all being spent on buying weapons in northern lebanon (tripoli) and being smuggled to the syrian "would-be" opposition.(he fhelped with this first hand). Northern lebanese MPs like khaled el daher and moustafa were caught red handed in facilitating this "arming" in later days. you can research it.

before you knew it, you heard "protesters shot by bashar's forces" . Now, is it so hard to speculate that some of these syrians were agents working for the CIA or Mossad? and that some of these agents would fire at the crowds of the protesters and make it look like the Syrian army? Before you knew it the opposition became a militia and a civil war started. 
What I am trying to say is, the events leading up to the civil war was orchestrated and not a natural revolution. After the opposition had acquired weapons, Bashar had all the legitimacy to fight them.
Anh here is where the media comes in "Bashar murders his own people" "Bashar the butcher" "barrel bombs"

Even though we saw opposition forces fire mortars and missiles aimlessly into syrian towns, every civilian death was blamed on Bashar's barrel bombs. Every major news channel made sure to make him into a monster.  But can anyone really prove first hand who is killing the civilians unless they are there on the ground? 

Can you believe the same narration as fox news,cnn, bbc , arabiya and al jazeera? 
Syria was actually in great shape before the war and had 100x times more freedom than the countries trying to "liberate" it.

The motive to start this false revolution is simple. break the axis of resistance to zionism. cut off the weapon supply route from Iran to hizbullah (because it is the ONLY route). Isn't this enough motive? And of-course the jews will never fight their own wars so they sent in the saudis. 

 

 

Great my brother. You have made everything crystal clear.

According to wikileaks, when Hillary Clinton was the secretary of state in 2008, her emails indicate that USA was planning to bring assad down since 2008. And Clinton sought help from Al Jazeera and Google to spread the lies that Assad is a tyrant.

Jazzakallah khair. May God bless you.

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يَا أَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا إِن جَاءَكُمْ فَاسِقٌ بِنَبَإٍ فَتَبَيَّنُوا أَن تُصِيبُوا قَوْمًا بِجَهَالَةٍ فَتُصْبِحُوا عَلَىٰ مَا فَعَلْتُمْ نَادِمِينَ
Translation:
O you who believe! If comes to you a wicked person with information, investigate, lest you harm a people in ignorance, then you become, over what you have done, regretful. (al-Hujurat 49:6)

Edited by Sabih

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3 hours ago, Mir Ali said:

According to wikileaks, when Hillary Clinton was the secretary of state in 2008, her emails indicate that USA was planning to bring assad down since 2008. And Clinton sought help from Al Jazeera and Google to spread the lies that Assad is a tyrant.

3

I think this is what you are referring to:

C05794498-1.jpg?resize=730%2C537

http://newobserveronline.com/clinton-destroy-syria-israel/

 

In a nutshell, the deal reached between the U.S. and Israel was that if the U.S. pursues a diplomatic route with Iran, it has to compensate Israel by taking out Syria.

Happy to do the job are ISIS, who can also give Islam a bad name in the process, double happiness for the colonialists.

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Even if David66 was an Israeli jew, he always seems to behave really well and I think he does not deserve to be kicked out due to where he was born or his religion. If he spreads misinformation it is the task of the people here to counter it so that everyone can benefit from seeing if it is misinformation or not and everyone can learn from it, not silencing others opinions (like Saddam Hussein and Yazid would do).

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On 6/13/2016 at 8:46 PM, sharinganMahdi said:

x

 

On 6/13/2016 at 8:53 PM, Ruq said:

x

 

On 6/13/2016 at 9:17 PM, The Light said:

x

 

On 6/13/2016 at 10:21 PM, baradar_jackson said:

x

 

Salamunalaykum brothers and sisters,

I rarely ever make such a statement, but i doubt there are many on here who have spent the time, commitment, as well as conducted some pretty thorough research on the syria issue, at times, it has even consumed me, bordering on obsession, which i have had to myself cut out.

I fully understand that there are great geopolitical incentives for America, Israel, and Gulf states, and an enormous stake for them. In leaked 2006 cables, you found the US wishing to exploit any kind of weakness in Syria, and to encourage uprisings. They have their own selfish geopolitical aims and desire's in syria. The US and Gulf states have helped to directly and indirectly fund groups which are linked to Alqaeda or work with them.

Forget Daesh, you have the likes of Jabhat Al Nusra, Jaysh al Islam, Ahrar Asham et al.

There are also NGO's who are paid by western governments and gulf states, extreme bias in the Media, and total and utter deception and corruption.

Iran and Hezbollah are on the side of Assad in this conflict, and i have openly said so am i. Because the alternative is Daesh, Ahrar Asham, Jaysh al Islam, and Jabhat Al Nusra, who are according to my research some of the most powerful groups fighting in Syria.

Assad is clearly and outrightly the lesser of the two evils, which is why Iran and Hezbollah are with him. 

However, please don't like in a utopia brothers and sisters. The syrian war is a bloody war which has occured for five years. Assad has rouge's in his army, and himself is not a masumeen. There have been crimes against humanity commited by both side's, and to claim Assad's army have not committed atrocities and crimes against humanity is bordering on ignoring blatant reality here.

We shia's should ultimately want the removal of terrorism in Syria, followed by proper internationally monitored elections, where proper parties are set up, in a context where there is no war, so the syrian people can  vote for their own future.

I truly dislike extreme's. Let's try to all develop an accurate, more nuanced understanding of this conflict.

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On 6/14/2016 at 10:18 PM, Khillo said:

I do not like him, I think that he and SOME of his soldiers have committed many war crimes. However, with that said, I do not think that a genocide of Alawis, Shias and Christians would be any better, so I believe he is the lesser evil and I support him against the terrorists.

A succinct and accurate assessment of the situation and in my eyes, the best position to take. 

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On 6/13/2016 at 11:57 PM, Abu-Jafar Herz said:

Bring your evidence against Bashar Al-Assad.

Brother, i will bring evidence, but you have got to be honest here. His army is huge, and to claim his generals, all of his soldiers are mas'umeen itself is incorrect, no?

Furthermore, as leader, he authorizes use of weapons. He has authorizes the use of Barrel Bombs. These bombs are pretty indiscriminate, the shrapnel flies everywhere, and it can and has maimed thousands of women and children.

It's not surprising in a complex war, in an area as small as syria, in such complexities with heavy weaponry, atrocities have been committed by both sides.

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On 6/15/2016 at 6:59 AM, Darth Vader said:

*crickets chirping*

 

On 6/13/2016 at 11:57 PM, Abu-Jafar Herz said:

Bring your evidence against Bashar Al-Assad.

 

Assad has admitted to using and allowing Barrel Bombs.

Here are a list of reported Barrel Bomb attacks: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Syrian_Civil_War_barrel_bomb_attacks

While there are definitely false reports, to claim it is all one big lie is similar to those who claim 9/11 was an inside job.

Video evidence of Barrel bombs being dropped, and in many instances, it looks like civilian populated regions. The opposition  do not own helicopters either:

 

 

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16 hours ago, David66 said:

Hello,

Sorry to disappoint you but I am neither.  Just your average American citizen.  I spent 7 years in the United States Air Force and now I design industrial air pollution control equipment. 

I do find your reaction to views that differ from yours interesting.  But, if we all had the same opinion I think the World would be a pretty boring place.

And, thanks for the narrative regarding the start of the war in Syria.  I do not agree with it in total.  But, you have some interesting points.

All the Best,

David

Please accept my apology on behalf of that user. I don't want you to feel based on one user making foul and absurd conspiracy comments against you, that the rest of us think in that way.

You and i may have major disagreements on politics, and current events, but it is not on me to start to speculate your race, religion, and country of origin.

 

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7 minutes ago, Ruq said:

@Tawheed313 Bruv, the quoting style youve adopted makes it look like we're all sending you kisses thinking gif.gif i mean, youre cool and all but we dont need to get all continental about it do we?

:grin: sorry

And God-forbid i didn't intend to make it seem so.

9GA9g.gif

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On 6/13/2016 at 6:57 PM, Abu-Jafar Herz said:

Bring your evidence against Bashar Al-Assad.

"On 10 July 2000, he was elected president succeeding Hafez al-Assad, his father, who had led Syria for 30 years and died in office a month prior. In both the Syrian presidential election, 2000 and subsequent 2007 election, Bashar Assad received votes in his favor in the upper 90th percentile in uncontested elections where other candidates were not permitted to run against him.[2][3] On 16 July 2014, Bashar Assad was sworn in for a new seven-year term, after taking 88.7% of votes in the presidential elections, running against two regime sanctioned candidates"

(Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bashar_al-Assad)

So in 2000 and 2007, Assad won in uncontested elections and in 2014, he won against two regime-sanctioned candidates. Sounds like a dictator to me and that in by itself is enough reason as to why he should leave office. As supporters of Imam Hussein's cause, we should not tolerate despots just because they're Shias or support other Shias. 

Edited by Ali666

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6 hours ago, Ali666 said:

"On 10 July 2000, he was elected president succeeding Hafez al-Assad, his father, who had led Syria for 30 years and died in office a month prior. In both the Syrian presidential election, 2000 and subsequent 2007 election, Bashar Assad received votes in his favor in the upper 90th percentile in uncontested elections where other candidates were not permitted to run against him.[2][3] On 16 July 2014, Bashar Assad was sworn in for a new seven-year term, after taking 88.7% of votes in the presidential elections, running against two regime sanctioned candidates"

(Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bashar_al-Assad)

So in 2000 and 2007, Assad won in uncontested elections and in 2014, he won against two regime-sanctioned candidates. Sounds like a dictator to me and that in by itself is enough reason as to why he should leave office. As supporters of Imam Hussein's cause, we should not tolerate despots just because they're Shias or support other Shias. 

Please don't give wikipedia as reference. Anyone can update info on wikipedia. 

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7 hours ago, Ali666 said:

"On 10 July 2000, he was elected president succeeding Hafez al-Assad, his father, who had led Syria for 30 years and died in office a month prior. In both the Syrian presidential election, 2000 and subsequent 2007 election, Bashar Assad received votes in his favor in the upper 90th percentile in uncontested elections where other candidates were not permitted to run against him.[2][3] On 16 July 2014, Bashar Assad was sworn in for a new seven-year term, after taking 88.7% of votes in the presidential elections, running against two regime sanctioned candidates"

(Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bashar_al-Assad)

So in 2000 and 2007, Assad won in uncontested elections and in 2014, he won against two regime-sanctioned candidates. Sounds like a dictator to me and that in by itself is enough reason as to why he should leave office. As supporters of Imam Hussein's cause, we should not tolerate despots just because they're Shias or support other Shias. 

 Bashar never stole power from his people he inherited his position as leader and with the support of his people. I can site you many examples where kings and queens ruled their people with love, justice, and mercy. Also, using this logic we can accuse Khumayni and Khamanei as being "dictators." The word dictator is a political tool that is used by the west and applied to leaders who are against the interests of the establishment in the west.

Also, even the west has admitted that Bashar Al Assad currently holds the majority support of his people. There was even a vote done in Lebanon among Syrian refugees where the majority of them voted in favor for Bashar.

Is Bashar is an Imam? No. Is he a religious person? No. But if it wasn't for him every single Christian from 7alab to Trablos would be cruficied, and every Shia masjid would be turned into rubble. I can't understand how people attack Bashar Al Assad and not look to his opponents. His opponents are paid mercenaries from the jail cells of Saudi Arabia sent to fight him.

Edited by Abu-Jafar Herz

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2 hours ago, Abu-Jafar Herz said:

 Bashar never stole power from his people he inherited his position as leader and with the support of his people. I can site you many examples where kings and queens ruled their people with love, justice, and mercy. Also, using this logic we can accuse Khumayni and Khamanei as being "dictators." The word dictator is a political tool that is used by the west and applied to leaders who are against the interests of the establishment in the west.

Also, even the west has admitted that Bashar Al Assad currently holds the majority support of his people. There was even a vote done in Lebanon among Syrian refugees where the majority of them voted in favor for Bashar.

Is Bashar is an Imam? No. Is he a religious person? No. But if it wasn't for him every single Christian from 7alab to Trablos would be cruficied, and every Shia masjid would be turned into rubble. I can't understand how people attack Bashar Al Assad and not look to his opponents. His opponents are paid mercenaries from the jail cells of Saudi Arabia sent to fight him.

Dear brother, sheikh,

You can not compare the system of Wilayatul Faqih, with the Assad dictatorship in syria. Iran also holds state-wide elections. Furthermore, a man like Bashar Al Assad is not fit to oil the dirt on the sandals of a man like ay.khamanei (ha).

Bashar Al Assad's Syria, while they did many good things, such as support Palestine, such as oppose american meddling in the middle east, such as support movements for justice, there was definitely repression at home.

Everyone agree's it is up to the syrian people to choose their own governments, leaders and presidents. Bashar Al Assad's father is responsible for terrible crimes, and Bashar himself is responsible for a violent crackdown on political dissidents.

He and the alawite's in charge and who have real control , have repressed other parties from really forming. There is religious freedom but very little political freedom.

This is what we shia's have got to try and make sure we do not fall into a trap for. Yes, Bashar is the lesser evil, yes, without him, there would be a shia genocide, and takfiri's would be in power, and zionist/american ideals would reign supreme,and gulf states would each try to balconize syria or atleast, control it indirectly through their terrorist forces they sponsor.

However, one can not ignore the fact that the syrian people have a right to determine their own leader. If Assad was so confident, he would have allowed far greater political freedom in 2005, 6, 7, etc. He would have allowed other parties to flourish and have proper elections.

 

 

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 The question isn't if the Syrians have the right to elect their reform their system or not, its if this is the proper time to be going about it. As has been mentioned, Syria's current situation is extremely fragile and any change in the system can easily be manipulated to create chaos and collapse the country. Think in terms of the Iran's 2009 color revolution and how basher Assad or anyone on the resistance's side victory will never be accepted by the opposition and accusations of cheating will fly around. Environment of calm is required to make any proper reforms possible.

Assad has currently withstood all forms of attacks from the enemies of Allah to side with the Shia led resistance. That speaks volumes about the man. All he has to do is side with the empire, like the rest of the Muslim nations, and he will be showered with praise and protection. Context is very important in assessing the situation.

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On 6/17/2016 at 5:11 PM, Tawheed313 said:

Dear brother, sheikh,

You can not compare the system of Wilayatul Faqih, with the Assad dictatorship in syria. Iran also holds state-wide elections. Furthermore, a man like Bashar Al Assad is not fit to oil the dirt on the sandals of a man like ay.khamanei (ha).

Bashar Al Assad's Syria, while they did many good things, such as support Palestine, such as oppose american meddling in the middle east, such as support movements for justice, there was definitely repression at home.

Everyone agree's it is up to the syrian people to choose their own governments, leaders and presidents. Bashar Al Assad's father is responsible for terrible crimes, and Bashar himself is responsible for a violent crackdown on political dissidents.

He and the alawite's in charge and who have real control , have repressed other parties from really forming. There is religious freedom but very little political freedom.

This is what we shia's have got to try and make sure we do not fall into a trap for. Yes, Bashar is the lesser evil, yes, without him, there would be a shia genocide, and takfiri's would be in power, and zionist/american ideals would reign supreme,and gulf states would each try to balconize syria or atleast, control it indirectly through their terrorist forces they sponsor.

However, one can not ignore the fact that the syrian people have a right to determine their own leader. If Assad was so confident, he would have allowed far greater political freedom in 2005, 6, 7, etc. He would have allowed other parties to flourish and have proper elections.

 

 

Salam dear bro, I hope this response finds you in good spirits.

My contention does not rely upon Bashar's moral character being on par with our sayeds, Khumayni and Khamanei. Rather, the term dictator cannot be by its essence immoral since we can cite many moral leaders who we can today label as "dictator." So using this as an argument against Bashaar cannot be true. 

Secondly, the majority of Bashaar's people support him. People seem to forget that Bashaar is a secular socialist from the Baathist party which is a pan Arab party. In Bashaar's and the armies eyes, its an Arab army versus a bunch of people in rags from eastern Europe, Somalia, Pakistan, And Afghanistan sent by the US and her allies to remove him.

Somali and Afghani salafists have no business in Syria. The main language of ISIS and FSA on the radio is almost always Bosnian, why is that?

Right now the best thing for us to do as Shia is to first deal with our problem we have in Syria and Iraq and then move on to our own problems which includes our allies like Bashaar if there is indeed a problem. 

Bashaar has punished army officials for going against his orders. Give me any army, I don't care if the Mukhtar al thaqafi is in charge of it. You will always have dissidents and people who don't listen.

Edited by Abu-Jafar Herz

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7 minutes ago, Abu-Jafar Herz said:

Salam dear bro, I hope this response finds you in good spirits.

My contention does not rely upon Bashar's moral character being on par with our sayeds, Khumayni and Khamanei. Rather, the term dictator cannot be by its essence immoral since we can cite many moral leaders who we can today label as "dictator." So using this as an argument against Bashaar cannot be true. 

Secondly, the majority of Bashaar's people support him. People seem to forget that Bashaar is a secular socialist from the Baathist party which is a pan Arab party. In Bashaar's and the armies eyes, its an Arab army versus a bunch of people in rags from eastern Europe, Somalia, Pakistan, And Afghanistan sent by the US and her allies to remove him.

Somali and Afghani salafists have no business in Syria. The main language of ISIS and FSA on the radio is almost always Bosnian, why is that?

Walaykum salam brother jazakAllah khayr,

You won't find a bigger opposor of the secterian terrorist groups in Syria than me. I have been vocally opposing them from early on. I consider Assad the lesser Evil, and would rather him in power, than them.

However, we must acknowledge that Assad's father was in power for decades, followed by his son.

In Iran, you would not have one family rule. The new leader would be chosen by an assembly of experts, and that process would be recycled. Furthermore, in Iran the president themselves is elected, and ay.khamanei (ha) does not meddle completely and totally, there is autonomy for the elected officials.

Assad on the other hand, has not been elected when you have the chance for no war, and other parties to properly form.

His alawite family control many of the key positions in syrian society.

As a follower of the ahlulbayt a.s, i have to be honest - his army has been responsible for crimes against humanity. The syrian people, once the fighting is over and the country rebuilds, need to engage in a political process whereby they form parties and engage in free and fair elections. Whoever they want to choose.

 

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Salam

I guess this topic has been completely discussed and we are just repeating and repeating. It's become useless and boring. Most of Syria is under control of enemy. 

Kurds are acting on their own, NATO has increased his presence in area and they are looking for plan B after collapse of ISIS.

So lets talk about something new.

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I understand from you: -ISIS are terrorists

-Syrian army are terrorists

-Hezbollah are terrorists

-Nusra are terrorists

and the 'free syrian army' are the heroes

 

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Syria before the war had no dept, syria didnt need anones help not americas help and nothing, they had food learning trading money everything before the war, syria was the greatest arabic country, but america and israel didnt want that, so sudently assad became a criminal

 

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