HassanShia

Evolution And Islam?

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2 hours ago, Al Hadi said:

What if God created amphibians then reptiles then other stuff doesn't prove evolution a creationist(which is somewhat like me but I have been a bit more open to evolution lately) could say this proves that God creates things in a certain order or fashion. Not that they evolved remember my automobile example nobody looks at 1950s convertible and 1970 then say that car gave birth too 10 different cars each with a different engine then one survived and started producing offspring. 

See the thing with the example is you could say a lot of that stuff is true the best version of the model was chosen to be continued and improved. Here is the thing though no one will say the car gave birth we know the car was made. Not that we know for sure scientifically at least humans and other animals were made but its not proven that creationism is false maybe a natural form of creationism happened that can be e scientifically one day happened and this might be in line with religious texts. Because of all that we can't say for sure that humans weren't made through some kind of creationism.

disclaimer I admit I still need to do more research I plan on reading Dawkins book the greatest show on earth and others so that way if I do or don't believe in evolution at least I know that I did all the research. For now though I say I'm not convinced cause there is no full 100% proof though this may be due to my lack of research for me it's still not proven. 

 

 

Well, in regards to my post above, I will leave you with one question.

Why would a phylogenetic tree built using DNA sequences, match a phylogenetic tree of the fossil record?

Once that question can be answered, the rest will have already fallen in place.

Aside from that, I believe in creation myself, but through natural means as you have described.  There is creationism that is young earth, instantaneous creationism, then there is creation via biological evolution and common descent.

Either way, all the best.  I recommend checking out other books on paleontology, such as those by Donald Prothero, or neil shubin or ken miller. Carl Sagan has good stuff. If you read dawkins, just keep in mind that it is written from a staunch anti religion point of view.  You will see that in his writing. If youre interested in some cheap geology books let me know. I know of some pretty good ones you can get for under 10 dollars.

Edited by iCambrian
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1 hour ago, iCambrian said:

Well, in regards to my post above, I will leave you with one question.

Why would a phylogenetic tree built using DNA sequences, match a phylogenetic tree of the fossil record?

Once that question can be answered, the rest will have already fallen in place.

Aside from that, I believe in creation myself, but through natural means as you have described.  There is creationism that is young earth, instantaneous creationism, then there is creation via biological evolution and common descent.

Either way, all the best.  I recommend checking out other books on paleontology, such as those by Donald Prothero, or neil shubin or ken miller. Carl Sagan has good stuff. If you read dawkins, just keep in mind that it is written from a staunch anti religion point of view.  You will see that in his writing. If youre interested in some cheap geology books let me know. I know of some pretty good ones you can get for under 10 dollars.

Ya DAwkins I feel if I can read his I will have read the most antireligious point of view and still have my views that's both a challenge then an achievement for me. Anyways I have to look at the phylogenetic tree thing you talk about.

Ill admit despite the anti evolution view I have I have to admit there are things that I cant answer like

#1 Male Nipples(y do we have them evolution makes a bit sense when it says they are vestigial I cant seem to find a use for them)

#2 Genetic marker that traces back to a tribe at around Ethiopia Africa. Kind of makes no sense that all humans have this genetic marker then when you go to this one tribe that I think my Darwinist biology teacher said are our ancestors. Then it makes sense that we evolved from them so that's another point evolution answers.

#3 Ill admit when I go to brain science a lot of it falls into place which is what actually sparked my interest in evolution first of all. Like we are addicted to junk food right? cause evolution says in our natural environment fat sugar and salt where rare in the environment evolution says we evolved to find these rare things important for our survival irresistibly enticing.

Also look here Gary Wilson the founder of the website uses evolution to prove why porn is so addictive  http://www.yourbrainonporn.com/ To be honest I could answer all this with God wanted to make sure we were generally capable of surviving in the environment he created us in(I mean traditional creationism). But Its interesting still how it can be made to  kind of relates to other places in science.

 

However with my experience there is always another side. I really want to research and find the truth though even if its unpopular I think some Shia Muslim scholars even are ok with evolution. Shaheed Murtadha  Muttaharee said at one point even if evolution was true it only proves God's wisdom being able to create human beings through this intelligent system.

Edited by Al Hadi
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On 26/12/2011 at 8:04 PM, HassanShia said:

Darwin's theory of evolution seems to convince people that species evolve over time to adapt to the environment etc. Now that does seem like a logical explanation and can be shown in us humans by our skin colors. Anyway Darwin said that we evolved from apes and scientists have found evidence to back this up such as Ardi's skeleton etc.

Then Islam says that Adam and Eve where the first humans and were sent down from HEAVEN. So this means that we cant have evolved from apes as Darwin states because Adam and Eve where the first humans.

But then again what hit me was the fact that if Adam and Eve where the first and only humans on the planet. So they reproduced and had kids. Now according to science if people who contain the same genes and reproduce they will form deformed babies. (There might be an explanation to this but I am not entirely sure).

So it goes on and I can't seem to find an explanation on what to believe in, both, or just Adam and Eve being the first humans.

Any detailed explanations would be great, and sorry if I made any wrong statements in my post.

Since the keyword 'Any' was used, I'll explain why evolution is not in harmony with Islam. 

Just to start you off, the whole 'history' the Quran presents. The story of Adam and Eve begins in Heaven as you pointed, while humans evolved on this Earth. The story of Adam - universally agreed upon, might I add - involves a single Adam and a single Eve, this can't be possible as this would end up in incestuous relationships and demented children - clearly not the case today.

Another is the many fossils found which indicate the previous links between humans and other primates through their common ancestors.

You also need to take into consideration the 'variety' of humans across the globe. There are small eyes, large eyes; big noses and small ones; taller people and shorter; only in rare occurances, such as an identical twin or a doppelganger, would any human look alike. When we take Islam's 'history' it argues that the Son's of Noah - Shem and Ham - the former who was white and the latter who was black, are the reason for this variety.

Islam states that Noah lived 1000 years and Adam was 30 meters, both of which are scientifically improbable.

If it helps a bit, the Jews and non-fundemental Christians both believe that the history proposed by the two testaments is purely metaphorical. 

 

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On January 1, 2017 at 11:21 AM, Fish said:

Since the keyword 'Any' was used, I'll explain why evolution is not in harmony with Islam. 

Just to start you off, the whole 'history' the Quran presents. The story of Adam and Eve begins in Heaven as you pointed, while humans evolved on this Earth. The story of Adam - universally agreed upon, might I add - involves a single Adam and a single Eve, this can't be possible as this would end up in incestuous relationships and demented children - clearly not the case today.

Another is the many fossils found which indicate the previous links between humans and other primates through their common ancestors.

You also need to take into consideration the 'variety' of humans across the globe. There are small eyes, large eyes; big noses and small ones; taller people and shorter; only in rare occurances, such as an identical twin or a doppelganger, would any human look alike. When we take Islam's 'history' it argues that the Son's of Noah - Shem and Ham - the former who was white and the latter who was black, are the reason for this variety.

Islam states that Noah lived 1000 years and Adam was 30 meters, both of which are scientifically improbable.

If it helps a bit, the Jews and non-fundemental Christians both believe that the history proposed by the two testaments is purely metaphorical. 

 

I see a lot of people doing this. If Christianity/Islam then not evolution, or if evolution then not christianity/Islam.

scriptures of religion were written thousands of years ago. They're attempts of mankind in describing something beyond ourselves. 

Science too is an ever proceeding attempt at understanding things that are beyond us.

You can't take subjective literature, and turn it into an objective "this scripture is/means X".

Scripture and science, ultimately having subjective traits, gives people the freedom to interpret and consider novel ideas about each. To the extent that science and religion are not mutually exclusive unless you choose to believe that they are.

islam and evolution are not in opposition to eachother, no more than Christianity and evolution. And there are many Muslims and Christians like myself, who are comfortable supporting the the theory of evolution, while still appreciating Sunday service.

 

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