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Why The Sunnis Prohibit Anal Sex And The Shia Not?


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#1 Abdullah11

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Posted 08 September 2010 - 06:04 PM

Salam
Alaikom,
I'm a sunni but I want to post my question here.
I posted following question on a Sunniforum:
AsSalamalaikum,
my question is:

What is Imam Malikis opinion on anal sex? Halal, Haram, Makroh?
In Imam Hajr al Azkalanis Hadith explanation of Al Bokhari is stated at page 681 of the explanation of the Ayat in Sura al Baqarah "Nisaokom harsol lakom...." that Maliki had a conversation with another scholar and Maliki had the opinion that anal sex is halal.

Also I find in Tabaris Tafsir of the same Ayat in Sura al Baqarah that there are a group of scholars which had the opinion that "...anna shi'tom... " means that you can enter your wife from which part you like.

In about every page in the internet I find that Anal Sex is Haram. But how about these books what I listed above?
I don't want that somebody replies to my question with the proofs why it is Haram, I find this many times in any other threads or sites.
I simply want that somebody replies to my questions above.

isA there is somebody.

AsSalamalaikum va rahmatollah


Actually I didn't got a proper answer for this.
Also I got stupid comments. And in the end thy moved my question to a private section where nobody answered it.
My question here is now why the Shias are allowing anal sex?
I know that they take the above sources as there Delil, but why they don't take the other Hadihs which are forbiding this act into consideration?

Thanks in advance and SalamAlaikom

#2 yassameen

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Posted 08 September 2010 - 06:23 PM

anna is condional word for time and place

it litrally means anytime anywhere , now we know men can not get close to their women during menses so is Qur'aan contradicting itself?

and who told you it is not haram , as far as i know regarding women part of this , if she voluntarly have anal sex she would have been doing something haram , if she had anal sex not with her consent she wouuld have done something that is makrooh

#3 Nader Zaveri

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Posted 08 September 2010 - 06:35 PM

(salam)
(bismillah)

There are two chapters dedicated in Wasaa'il, in the Kitaab Al-NikaaH, that talk about Anal sex with your wife. The maraaja' (scholars) derive their ruling from there.

72 - بَابُ كَرَاهَةِ الْوَطْءِ فِي الدُّبُرِ وَ جَوَازِ الْإِتْيَانِ فِي الْفَرْجِ مِنْ خَلْفٍ وَ قُدَّامٍ
"Chapter on the dislike of sexual intercourse in the anus and the permissibility to go in the vagina from behind or from in front of”
  • Source:
  • Al-`Aamilee, Wasaa'il Al-Shee`ah, vol. 20, pg. 141, ch. 72
73 - بَابُ عَدَمِ تَحْرِيمِ وَطْءِ الزَّوْجَةِ وَ السُّرِّيَّةِ فِي الدُّبُرِ
“Chapter on the absence of prohibition of sexual intercourse (with) the wife and mistress (mut’a wife) in the anus”
  • Source:
  • Al-`Aamilee, Wasaa'il Al-Shee`ah, vol. 20, pg. 145, ch. 73
Here is a hadeeth from the first section.

عَنْهُ عَنْ عَلِيِّ بْنِ الْحَكَمِ قَالَ سَمِعْتُ صَفْوَانَ يَقُولُ قُلْتُ لِلرِّضَا ع إِنَّ رَجُلًا مِنْ مَوَالِيكَ أَمَرَنِي أَنْ أَسْأَلَكَ عَنْ مَسْأَلَةٍ فَهَابَكَ وَ اسْتَحَى مِنْكَ أَنْ يَسْأَلَكَ قَالَ مَا هِيَ قَالَ قُلْتُ الرَّجُلُ يَأْتِي امْرَأَتَهُ فِي دُبُرِهَا قَالَ نَعَمْ ذَلِكَ لَهُ قُلْتُ فَأَنْتَ تَفْعَلُ ذَلِكَ قَالَ لَا إِنَّا لَا نَفْعَلُ ذَلِكَ
In Red: “I said: 'Can a man come to his wife in her anus?'. He (as) said: 'Yes that is for him.' I said: 'Do you do this?' He (as) said: 'No, I do not do this.'
  • Source:
  • Al-Toosi, Tahdheeb Al-aHkaam, vol. 7, pg. 415 - 416, hadeeth # 35
  • Al-`Aamilee, Wasaa'il Al-Shee`ah, vol. 20, ch. 72, pg. 145, hadeeth # 25259
    Grading:
  • Al-Majlisi said this hadeeth is SaHeeH
    --> Milaadh Al-Akhyaar, vol. 12, pg. 360
Here is another hadeeth, and this is the hadeeth that you can see where the maraaja' (scholars) gets the part of "With wifes permission"

وَ عَنْهُ عَنْ عَلِيِّ بْنِ أَسْبَاطٍ عَنْ مُحَمَّدِ بْنِ حُمْرَانَ عَنْ عَبْدِ اللَّهِ بْنِ أَبِي يَعْفُورٍ قَالَ سَأَلْتُ أَبَا عَبْدِ اللَّهِ ع عَنِ الرَّجُلِ يَأْتِي الْمَرْأَةَ فِي دُبُرِهَا قَالَ لَا بَأْسَ إِذَا رَضِيَتْ قُلْتُ فَأَيْنَ قَوْلُ اللَّهِ عَزَّ وَ جَلَّ فَأْتُوهُنَّ مِنْ حَيْثُ أَمَرَكُمُ اللَّهُ (البقرة -: 222 -) قَالَ هَذَا فِي طَلَبِ الْوَلَدِ فَاطْلُبُوا الْوَلَدَ مِنْ حَيْثُ أَمَرَكُمُ اللَّهُ إِنَّ اللَّهَ تَعَالَى يَقُولُ نِساؤُكُمْ حَرْثٌ لَكُمْ فَأْتُوا حَرْثَكُمْ أَنَّى شِئْتُمْ (البقرة -: 223 -)
In Red: "I asked the Abaa `Abdallaah (as): 'Can a man come to his wife from her anus?' He said: 'There is no problem if she agrees to it'"
  • Source:
  • Al-Toosi, Tahdheeb Al-aHkaam, vol. 7, pg. 414, hadeeth # 29
  • Al-`Aamilee, Wasaa'il Al-Shee`ah, vol. 20, ch. 72, pg. 146, hadeeth # 25260
  • Grading:
  • Al-Majlisi said this hadeeth is Muwaththaq (Reliable)
    --> Milaadh Al-Akhyaar, vol. 12, pg. 356

Basically Anal Sex is permitted, but EXTREMELY disliked.

(salam)

Edited by Nader Zaveri, 08 September 2010 - 06:39 PM.


#4 89jghur32

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Posted 08 September 2010 - 09:41 PM

(salam)
(bismillah)

There are two chapters dedicated in Wasaa'il, in the Kitaab Al-NikaaH, that talk about Anal sex with your wife. The maraaja' (scholars) derive their ruling from there.

72 - ÈóÇÈõ ßóÑóÇåóÉö ÇáúæóØúÁö Ýöí ÇáÏõøÈõÑö æó ÌóæóÇÒö ÇáúÅöÊúíóÇäö Ýöí ÇáúÝóÑúÌö ãöäú ÎóáúÝò æó ÞõÏóøÇãò
"Chapter on the dislike of sexual intercourse in the anus and the permissibility to go in the vagina from behind or from in front of”

  • Source:
  • Al-`Aamilee, Wasaa'il Al-Shee`ah, vol. 20, pg. 141, ch. 72
73 - ÈóÇÈõ ÚóÏóãö ÊóÍúÑöíãö æóØúÁö ÇáÒóøæúÌóÉö æó ÇáÓõøÑöøíóøÉö Ýöí ÇáÏõøÈõÑö
“Chapter on the absence of prohibition of sexual intercourse (with) the wife and mistress (mut’a wife) in the anus”
  • Source:
  • Al-`Aamilee, Wasaa'il Al-Shee`ah, vol. 20, pg. 145, ch. 73
Here is a hadeeth from the first section.

Úóäúåõ Úóäú Úóáöíöø Èúäö ÇáúÍóßóãö ÞóÇáó ÓóãöÚúÊõ ÕóÝúæóÇäó íóÞõæáõ ÞõáúÊõ áöáÑöøÖóÇ Ú Åöäóø ÑóÌõáðÇ ãöäú ãóæóÇáöíßó ÃóãóÑóäöí Ãóäú ÃóÓúÃóáóßó Úóäú ãóÓúÃóáóÉò ÝóåóÇÈóßó æó ÇÓúÊóÍóì ãöäúßó Ãóäú íóÓúÃóáóßó ÞóÇáó ãóÇ åöíó ÞóÇáó ÞõáúÊõ ÇáÑóøÌõáõ íóÃúÊöí ÇãúÑóÃóÊóåõ Ýöí ÏõÈõÑöåóÇ ÞóÇáó äóÚóãú Ðóáößó áóåõ ÞõáúÊõ ÝóÃóäúÊó ÊóÝúÚóáõ Ðóáößó ÞóÇáó áóÇ ÅöäóøÇ áóÇ äóÝúÚóáõ Ðóáößó
In Red: “I said: 'Can a man come to his wife in her anus?'. He (as) said: 'Yes that is for him.' I said: 'Do you do this?' He (as) said: 'No, I do not do this.'
  • Source:
  • Al-Toosi, Tahdheeb Al-aHkaam, vol. 7, pg. 415 - 416, hadeeth # 35
  • Al-`Aamilee, Wasaa'il Al-Shee`ah, vol. 20, ch. 72, pg. 145, hadeeth # 25259
    Grading:
  • Al-Majlisi said this hadeeth is SaHeeH
    --> Milaadh Al-Akhyaar, vol. 12, pg. 360
Here is another hadeeth, and this is the hadeeth that you can see where the maraaja' (scholars) gets the part of "With wifes permission"

æó Úóäúåõ Úóäú Úóáöíöø Èúäö ÃóÓúÈóÇØò Úóäú ãõÍóãóøÏö Èúäö ÍõãúÑóÇäó Úóäú ÚóÈúÏö Çááóøåö Èúäö ÃóÈöí íóÚúÝõæÑò ÞóÇáó ÓóÃóáúÊõ ÃóÈóÇ ÚóÈúÏö Çááóøåö Ú Úóäö ÇáÑóøÌõáö íóÃúÊöí ÇáúãóÑúÃóÉó Ýöí ÏõÈõÑöåóÇ ÞóÇáó áóÇ ÈóÃúÓó ÅöÐóÇ ÑóÖöíóÊú ÞõáúÊõ ÝóÃóíúäó Þóæúáõ Çááóøåö ÚóÒóø æó Ìóáóø ÝóÃúÊõæåõäóø ãöäú ÍóíúËõ ÃóãóÑóßõãõ Çááóøåõ (ÇáÈÞÑÉ -: 222 -) ÞóÇáó åóÐóÇ Ýöí ØóáóÈö ÇáúæóáóÏö ÝóÇØúáõÈõæÇ ÇáúæóáóÏó ãöäú ÍóíúËõ ÃóãóÑóßõãõ Çááóøåõ Åöäóø Çááóøåó ÊóÚóÇáóì íóÞõæáõ äöÓÇÄõßõãú ÍóÑúËñ áóßõãú ÝóÃúÊõæÇ ÍóÑúËóßõãú Ãóäóøì ÔöÆúÊõãú (ÇáÈÞÑÉ -: 223 -)
In Red: "I asked the Abaa `Abdallaah (as): 'Can a man come to his wife from her anus?' He said: 'There is no problem if she agrees to it'"
  • Source:
  • Al-Toosi, Tahdheeb Al-aHkaam, vol. 7, pg. 414, hadeeth # 29
  • Al-`Aamilee, Wasaa'il Al-Shee`ah, vol. 20, ch. 72, pg. 146, hadeeth # 25260
  • Grading:
  • Al-Majlisi said this hadeeth is Muwaththaq (Reliable)
    --> Milaadh Al-Akhyaar, vol. 12, pg. 356

Basically Anal Sex is permitted, but EXTREMELY disliked.

(salam)


From what I've read, Sayyid al-Khoe'i changed his ruling on this issue from what you've mentioned to absolutely prohibited. He reasoned that the narrations that limitedly approve of anal sex were issued out of taqiyyah because the contemporary opinion amongst the `Amma in the times of the Imams (as) was that anal sex was permissible. As such, the opposite ruling has to be taken that it is prohibited without a doubt. Maybe someone else can shed some light on this.

#5 Salawat

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Posted 09 September 2010 - 05:36 AM

From what I've read, Sayyid al-Khoe'i changed his ruling on this issue from what you've mentioned to absolutely prohibited. He reasoned that the narrations that limitedly approve of anal sex were issued out of taqiyyah because the contemporary opinion amongst the `Amma in the times of the Imams (as) was that anal sex was permissible. As such, the opposite ruling has to be taken that it is prohibited without a doubt. Maybe someone else can shed some light on this.


Do you mean to say the other aimma of madhabs permitted it?
I have issues with that:
1. no one was going to harm your precious Imam for holding differing opinions, if that were the case there woulnt be 10s of differing madhabs in the first few centuries. The claim of taqiyya is unfounded and baseless.

2. The "non-shia" imams of that time overwhelmingly prohibited/disliked anal sex.

Truth of the matter is, there are no explicit authentic narrations from the Prophet (pbuh) either permitting it or prohibiting it.

Salam
Alaikom,
I'm a sunni but I want to post my question here.
I posted following question on a Sunniforum:
AsSalamalaikum,
my question is:

What is Imam Malikis opinion on anal sex? Halal, Haram, Makroh?
In Imam Hajr al Azkalanis Hadith explanation of Al Bokhari is stated at page 681 of the explanation of the Ayat in Sura al Baqarah "Nisaokom harsol lakom...." that Maliki had a conversation with another scholar and Maliki had the opinion that anal sex is halal.

Also I find in Tabaris Tafsir of the same Ayat in Sura al Baqarah that there are a group of scholars which had the opinion that "...anna shi'tom... " means that you can enter your wife from which part you like.

In about every page in the internet I find that Anal Sex is Haram. But how about these books what I listed above?
I don't want that somebody replies to my question with the proofs why it is Haram, I find this many times in any other threads or sites.
I simply want that somebody replies to my questions above.

isA there is somebody.

AsSalamalaikum va rahmatollah


Actually I didn't got a proper answer for this.
Also I got stupid comments. And in the end thy moved my question to a private section where nobody answered it.
My question here is now why the Shias are allowing anal sex?
I know that they take the above sources as there Delil, but why they don't take the other Hadihs which are forbiding this act into consideration?

Thanks in advance and SalamAlaikom


YOu did, in fact one of the fist posts was mine where I answered all your questions :)

#6 londonsmooth110

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Posted 09 September 2010 - 06:15 AM

The Jews used to say that if (the man) had intercourse from behind, the child would be born with a squint. Then the verse “Your wives are a tilth for you, so go to your tilth when or how you will” [al-Baqarah 2:223] was revealed. But this is a misunderstanding of the verse. Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì says “so go to your tilth when or how you will” which means that all variations of intercourse are permitted, so long as it is in the place of tilth, i.e., the vagina, not the back passage. So it is permissible for a man to have intercourse with his wife from behind or from in front or lying on their sides so long as it is in the place of tilth and not the back passage.


Imam Ja’far as-Sadiq (a.s.) has stated:

“Penetrating the anal opening is a greater sin than penetrating the vagina. Certainly Allah destroyed a complete Umma (Umma of Hazrat Lut (a.s.) because they indulged in sodomy. Allah has not destroyed even one man for adultery”.

(Al-Kafi)

Now in the above hadith it is refering to a woman as for the obvious reason that a man does not have a vagina unless he has some medical issues. I think that it could lead to sodomy thus it is best to stay away from it full stop. Anyway why would anyone wana do it up the Sh*t passage in the first place? the woman dont enjoy it and it could lead to serious sexual dieases.

Edited by londonsmooth110, 09 September 2010 - 06:18 AM.


#7 Abdullah11

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Posted 09 September 2010 - 06:35 AM

The Jews used to say that if (the man) had intercourse from behind, the child would be born with a squint. Then the verse “Your wives are a tilth for you, so go to your tilth when or how you will” [al-Baqarah 2:223] was revealed. But this is a misunderstanding of the verse. Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì says “so go to your tilth when or how you will” which means that all variations of intercourse are permitted, so long as it is in the place of tilth, i.e., the vagina, not the back passage. So it is permissible for a man to have intercourse with his wife from behind or from in front or lying on their sides so long as it is in the place of tilth and not the back passage.


Imam Ja’far as-Sadiq (a.s.) has stated:

“Penetrating the anal opening is a greater sin than penetrating the vagina. Certainly Allah destroyed a complete Umma (Umma of Hazrat Lut (a.s.) because they indulged in sodomy. Allah has not destroyed even one man for adultery”.

(Al-Kafi)

Now in the above hadith it is refering to a woman as for the obvious reason that a man does not have a vagina unless he has some medical issues. I think that it could lead to sodomy thus it is best to stay away from it full stop. Anyway why would anyone wana do it up the Sh*t passage in the first place? the woman dont enjoy it and it could lead to serious sexual dieases.



Salamalaikom,
I want to know how Shia Moslims are standing (I mean their opinion) to the Ahadith which are mentioned by the Sunnis which are prohibiting this act?
As for example, I find in Wikipedia:
Most Muslim jurists agree that anal sex is haram, based on the hadith: "Do not have anal sex with women", reported by Ahmad, At-Tirmidhi, Al-Nasa'i and Ibn Majah and the hadith of Abu Dawood[6], such as Ibn Kathir, [7][8] Muhammad ibn al Uthaymeen[9] and Muhammad Nasiruddin al-Albani.[10].

Khuzaima ibn Thabit also reports that the messenger of Allah said: "Allah is not too shy to tell you the truth: "Do not have sex with your wives in the anus", reported by Ahmad, 5/213.

`Abd Allah ibn `Abbas narrates: "The Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him, said: "Allah will not look at a man who has anal sex with his wife", reported by Ibn Abi Shaybah (3/529) and At-Tirmidhi, classified it as an authentic hadith (1165).

Edited by Abdullah11, 09 September 2010 - 06:37 AM.


#8 doobybrother

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Posted 09 September 2010 - 06:51 AM

Then the verse "Your wives are a tilth for you, so go to your tilth when or how you will" [al-Baqarah 2:223] was revealed. But this is a misunderstanding of the verse. Allah ÓÈÍÇäå æÊÚÇáì says "so go to your tilth when or how you will" which means that all variations of intercourse are permitted, so long as it is in the place of tilth, i.e., the vagina, not the back passage. So it is permissible for a man to have intercourse with his wife from behind or from in front or lying on their sides so long as it is in the place of tilth and not the back passage.


Do you have any hadith that supports this tafseer of yours?

Imam Ja'far as-Sadiq (a.s.) has stated:

"Penetrating the anal opening is a greater sin than penetrating the vagina. Certainly Allah destroyed a complete Umma (Umma of Hazrat Lut (a.s.) because they indulged in sodomy. Allah has not destroyed even one man for adultery".

(Al-Kafi)

Now in the above hadith it is refering to a woman as for the obvious reason that a man does not have a vagina unless he has some medical issues. I think that it could lead to sodomy thus it is best to stay away from it full stop. Anyway why would anyone wana do it up the Sh*t passage in the first place? the woman dont enjoy it and it could lead to serious sexual dieases.



As I understand the above hadith is about sodomy/homosexuality not about sex with ones lawful wife.
It would be great if someone can post the whole tradition.
Also, in the book Greater Sins (most probably from where uv taken this) Ayatollah Dastgaib Sherazi has placed this hadith in the chapter of Sodomy.

Salamalaikom,
I want to know how Shia Moslims are standing (I mean their opinion) to the Ahadith which are mentioned by the Sunnis which are prohibiting this act?



Sunni hadiths are not hujjah on us.

Edited by doobybrother, 09 September 2010 - 06:58 AM.


#9 Yasoob Al Deen

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Posted 09 September 2010 - 12:53 PM

From what I've read, Sayyid al-Khoe'i changed his ruling on this issue from what you've mentioned to absolutely prohibited. He reasoned that the narrations that limitedly approve of anal sex were issued out of taqiyyah because the contemporary opinion amongst the `Amma in the times of the Imams (as) was that anal sex was permissible. As such, the opposite ruling has to be taken that it is prohibited without a doubt. Maybe someone else can shed some light on this.


Good reasoning. However is there evidence that the contemporary scholars ruled it was permissible? E.g. names and quotes?
Peace.

#10 jund_el_Mahdi

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Posted 09 September 2010 - 01:10 PM

(bismillah)

Not sure what other maraja say about it, but according to Imam Khamenei, it is persmissible, unless it is to the point where your wife becomes extremely uncomfortable(pain), then it should be avoided.

#11 Gypsy

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Posted 10 September 2010 - 09:52 AM

(salam)
This was posted awhile back.

Question : When a woman is in her period, can she have anal intercourse?

§ Answer : If wife is consenting to it, it is permissible but it would be extremely abominable.



2

§ Question : What is the ruling on anal sex? Is a Moslem allowed to have anal sex?

§ Answer : Based on the widely held opinion of Shiite scholars this act (anal sex) is strongly Makrooh (undesirable, what is not Haram to do, but it is better to avoid). There is no objection to the couple getting pleasure from the entire body of one another. But it should be taken into consideration that some actions are beneath human dignity.



3

§ Question : Is anal intercourse permissible.?

§ Answer : Permission is bound to wife’s agreement, but it is strongly undesirable.


From http://sistani.org/h...p...=eng&part=4

http://www.shiachat....ng-husbandwife/

#12 Abbas

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Posted 10 September 2010 - 01:19 PM

Salam Alaikum

Good reasoning. However is there evidence that the contemporary scholars ruled it was permissible? E.g. names and quotes?
Peace.


Maybe its something to do with the hadeeth narrated by Al-Sheikh Al-Tusi:
Narrated by Ahmad ibn Isa, from Mu`ammar ibn Khallad, from Al-Imam Abul-Hasan Al-Ridha [a], in which the Imam [a] was informed that the people of Madinah see no harm in anal sex.

But Al-Sheikh Al-Tusi also narrated from Mu`ammar ibn Khallad, through the narrator Mu`awiyah ibn Hukaim, that he was informed the same about the Ahlul-Kitab, rather than the Ahlul-Madinah, albeit this isnad is dha`eef according to Al-Sayyid Al-Khoi.

I haven't checked with Sunni sources, but in Masalik-ul-Afham, Al-Shaheed Al-Thani mentioned that according to one view, Malik didn't deem anal sex haram, and it is also narrated by some students of Al-Shafi`i that he said that there is nothing authentic from the Prophet [s] which indicates that it is haram or halal, and qiyas dictates that it is halal, and that many ulama stood by this opinion of Al-Shafi`i.

Allahu A`lam

#13 Haydar Husayn

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Posted 10 September 2010 - 07:09 PM

From what I've read, Sayyid al-Khoe'i changed his ruling on this issue from what you've mentioned to absolutely prohibited. He reasoned that the narrations that limitedly approve of anal sex were issued out of taqiyyah because the contemporary opinion amongst the `Amma in the times of the Imams (as) was that anal sex was permissible. As such, the opposite ruling has to be taken that it is prohibited without a doubt. Maybe someone else can shed some light on this.

I find it hard to believe that taqiyya was needed on an issue such as this.

#14 Gypsy

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Posted 10 September 2010 - 08:41 PM

(salam)
I have deleted few posts that were very tasteless.

I urge everyone to avoid personal opinion in this matter. This is not a question about your sexual preference. Please refrain speaking about something that you have no knowledge off.

From what I've read, Sayyid al-Khoe'i changed his ruling on this issue from what you've mentioned to absolutely prohibited. He reasoned that the narrations that limitedly approve of anal sex were issued out of taqiyyah because the contemporary opinion amongst the `Amma in the times of the Imams (as) was that anal sex was permissible. As such, the opposite ruling has to be taken that it is prohibited without a doubt. Maybe someone else can shed some light on this.

Hopefully someone else may be able to shed more lights on this issue. I don’t think what you said is unbelievable. This is also one of the issues that I would practice taqqiyah.

According to the Sunnis, anal intercourse is classifies as “Sodomy” even if it is done between husband and wife (with prior permission from wife).

I know some Sunni women who asked for divorce from their husband because their husband had personal “fetish” for the anal intercourse. I am told that according to their madhab, this is one of the most detested acts. It is as if you have committed homosexual relationship.

#15 Haydar Husayn

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Posted 10 September 2010 - 08:59 PM

(salam)
This is also one of the issues that I would practice taqqiyah.

According to the Sunnis, anal intercourse is classifies as “Sodomy” even if it is done between husband and wife (with prior permission from wife).

I know some Sunni women who asked for divorce from their husband because their husband had personal “fetish” for the anal intercourse. I am told that according to their madhab, this is one of the most detested acts. It is as if you have committed homosexual relationship.

Ok, but why would the Imam (as) practice taqqiyah on this issue then? I could maybe understand if he wanted to say it was allowed, because that could be seen to be controversial. But I find it hard to believe that there was ever a time when anal intercourse was so widespread in the Muslim world that it would be necessary to practice taqiyyah on this issue by saying it is allowed.

#16 Gypsy

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Posted 10 September 2010 - 09:11 PM

(salam)
I am not saying the Imam practices taqiyah. I am asking you to look at the ruling for the anal sex. It is not halal or haram, it is makrooh. Furthermore, it is only allowed when you have permission from your wife.

One of the problem is if you are living in a Sunni Muslim country, they have rules about Sodomy that sometimes covers anal intercourse between husband and wife!

#17 Haydar Husayn

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Posted 10 September 2010 - 09:32 PM

(salam)
I am not saying the Imam practices taqiyah. I am asking you to look at the ruling for the anal sex. It is not halal or haram, it is makrooh. Furthermore, it is only allowed when you have permission from your wife.

Yeah, I know what the ruling is, but I'm trying to understand what the need to practice taqiyya for the Imam might have been.

One of the problem is if you are living in a Sunni Muslim country, they have rules about Sodomy that sometimes covers anal intercourse between husband and wife!


If you are saying that you would practice taqiyya on this issue if you were in a Sunni country, then I agree that might be the best course of action. However, the situation the Imam was in appears to be the opposite according to Sayed Koei. Obviously we don't know if the Imam did in fact practice taqiyya, but that is the conclusion Sayed Koei came to, so I'm trying to figure out why it might have been necessary.

#18 Abbas

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Posted 11 September 2010 - 04:44 AM

Sayyed Al-Khoi saw that it was a possibility that it was in taqiyyah, so he ruled that it is wajib as a precaution (ihtiyat-e-wajib) to refrain from it. He did not give a fatwa.
There are quite a few quotes available in books from mainstream Sunni ulama of the particular era who allowed anal intercourse.

#19 Abdullah11

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Posted 11 September 2010 - 06:19 AM

Sayyed Al-Khoi saw that it was a possibility that it was in taqiyyah, so he ruled that it is wajib as a precaution (ihtiyat-e-wajib) to refrain from it. He did not give a fatwa.
There are quite a few quotes available in books from mainstream Sunni ulama of the particular era who allowed anal intercourse.

AsSalamAlaikom,
Do you know who from the Sunni Olama allowed it? And do you have a source?
What is the reason why they allowed it? Is it the Ayah from Sura Baqara or are there other reasons too?

#20 Mohammed-W

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Posted 11 September 2010 - 09:57 AM

I find it hard to believe that taqiyya was needed on an issue such as this.

I find it hard to believe it was not.


Imam (as) do not hold the authority, man asks about sodomy and is practicing already with his wife...stupid question gets stupid answer! What can the imam say when the man says it is being done and asks him what does he say? as if he would have Imam discuss sodomy. which is what it is. Could you think now if he gives a ruling in accordance with truth (that it is sodomy) the enemies (of whom the questioner could have been) would discuss to death this issue. Much as Shia chatters do when they have another agenda.

Simple
1. people are sodomizing their wives, or presenting the scenario in past tense terms.
2. NO prophet, imam or shia does this.
3. a 'person' asks "what do you SAY about blah blah.( a man who DOES THIS) past tense...it is being done for sake of twisted discussion.
4. Imam SAYS ..... which is to say nothing the saying is in effect as twisted as the question.

make up any sick question in your mind imagine you are imam with true followers and opposite then you can see the answer is to keep these two people who love anal intercourse doing what the hell they want since they would go so far as to ask for ruling....and if they have done it they are nearly a lost cause any way. 99.9$ perverse and deserving to rot in hell. so who cares what answer imam gives to stupid rhetorical question that is shamefull etc?

I wont discuss any more this is offensive to normal human beings, as it is offensive to the Imam that it does not deserve attention of any person believein in Allah and the last day.
Shaytain is a sodomite prophets are not.

#21 Haydar Husayn

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Posted 13 September 2010 - 03:58 AM

Islam prohibits anal sex. Anyone who considers him/herself a muslim will not do it unless he's a hypocrite. Nobody has the right to allow what Allah has prohibited.So how can Shias allow that? Think 100 times before you make a statement like that, or even better, do some proper research before you post any such questions!

I am a Shia and I know for sure that we are not allowed to have anal sex. I don't know who told you Shias allow that! I can even post references from Quran and Hadees about that!

Please do, specifically from the Qur'an.

#22 Not_a_Stepford_wife

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Posted 13 September 2010 - 06:01 PM

Some shia mujtahids consider anal sex as haraam, and some shia mujtahids say it is not haram but makrooh that means it is permissible but strongly undesirable (if the wife agrees to it then it is ok otherwise it is advisable not to go for it since it is very painful for the woman and although men are told to approach their wives however they wish they have to make sure they don't harm the woman in the process.

Now I'm confused. :wacko:

I told the OP to think 100 times before you make a statement like that, or even better, do some proper research before you post any such questions! well. that applies to me as well. Sorry about that anyway. I'm such an idiot. but believe me I was so sure it was haraam until last night.

#23 Yasoob Al Deen

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Posted 14 September 2010 - 10:46 AM

Lol. Don't worry about it not_a_stepford_wife. We all make mistakes. Just as long as we're willing to admit them ;)
Peace.

#24 neutral.sage

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Posted 07 January 2011 - 09:11 PM

Its haram as its not even Fitri.

this is the ref that i could find the quickest

http://www.answering...om/anal_sex.htm

oral sex could give diseases as mouth is full of bacteria. most people as they go give foul smell of bacteria.

anal sex can cause many VD's.

a large number of zionists have been observed to have their wives die young due to such practices which gave them diseases. I met once a guy - a jewish lawyer whose 3 wives had died, and he himself got tongue cancer from drinking.

these are unnatural things and what to talk of mind control - and jihad and fasting and prayer - if this much little cannot be done ?

Edited by neutral.sage, 07 January 2011 - 09:18 PM.


#25 Gypsy

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Posted 08 January 2011 - 07:53 AM

(salam)
Most of the Islamic laws are not time-bound. As for the anal-sex, one of the factors that need to be taken into consideration is if you wife allows it (see the original fatwa by the marjas).

I found another discussion on SC
http://www.shiachat....ct-sistani-law/



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