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imran7

Imam Mahdi - The Last Messenger. ?

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This is my personal research and view and certainly does not constitute as of my faith or belief as this has not been confirmed by any Shiite or Sunni Cleric however they have not replied it either. So I wanted to discuss with this forums in search of getting better knowledge and views of this Promise by Prophets for a messenger mentioned in Quran 3:81.

Imam Mahdi – The Last Messenger of God. ?

Before we address the issue if Imam Mahdi is the Messenger of God or not ? Here are Three Points you consider first.

1. Prophet Muhammad (S) is the Last Prophet

2. There is a Promise from All Prophets to help a Messenger to come. (3:81)

3. We Know Prophet Jesus to bear witness and help Imam Mahdi.

Difference Between Prophet (äÈی) and Messenger (ÑÓæá)

Every Prophet is a messenger however Every Messenger is not a Prophet.

i.e. Angel Gabriel is also a Messenger but of course not a Prophet.

Two Kinds of Messengers: One is Nabi and other one is Rasool.

Who is Nabi?

A Messenger with a Book and Shariat means ' Nabi ' or ' Prophet '

A Messenger who is given a book is called Prophet he forms or revise Religion of Allah with the support of that Book and conveys message to people.

Who is Rasool?

A Messenger who confirms the Book and Protect the Shariat from Alteration means " Rasool or Messenger ". Messenger who is not given a Book is called " Messenger " or " Rasool " He does not alter or revise religion of Allah he only conveys the message and teaches book of Allah to people and protect the Shariat of Prophet from alteration or in other words safeguards the Religion.

Both of the Messengers however are appointed by Allah.

Surah-e-Hajj No.22 And Verses No. 75 (CH:22 VS:75)

"Allah chooses messengers from among the angels and from among the men; surely Allah is Hearing, Seeing"

ٱááøóåõ íóÕۡØóÝöی ãöäó ٱáۡãóáóÜٰۤٮٕöڪóÉö ÑõÓõáÇóó æóãöäó ٱáäøóÇÓöۚ Çٕöäøó ٱááøóåó ÓóãöíÚõۢ ÈóÕöíÑõõ

The First Thing Jesus (S) spoke to the peole was the defination of " Prophet" or " Nabi"

Surah Marayam (Marry) No. 19 Verses No. 30

He said: Surely I am a servant of Allah; He has given me the Book and made me a prophet; {19:30}

ÞóÇáó Çٕöäøöی ÚóÈۡÏõ ٱááøóåö ÁóÇÊóٮٰäöیó ٱáۡßöÊóÜٰÈó æóÌóÚóáóäöی äóÈöíøóóÇ

Defination of Messenger - Rasool in Quran.

Surah Al Bakara No. 2 Verses No. 101

And when there came to them a Messenger from Allah confirming what was with them, a party of those who were given the scripture threw away the book of Allah behind their backs as if they did not know.

æóáóãøóÇ ÌóÂÁóåõãۡ ÑóÓõæáõõ ãøöäۡ ÚöäÏö ٱááøóåö ãõÕóÏøöÞõõ áøöãóÇ ãóÚóåõãۡ äóÈóÐó ÝóÑöíÞõõ ãøöäó ٱáøóÐöíäó ÃõæÊõæÇú ٱáۡßöÊóÜٰÈó ڪöÊóÜٰÈó ٱááøóåö æóÑóÂÁó ÙõåõæÑöåöãۡ ßóÃóäøóåõãۡ áóÇ íóÚۡáóãõæäó

Promise of Prophets for a Messenger.

Surah Al-e-Imran No. 3 and Verses No. 81

"Behold! Allah took the covenant of the prophets, saying: "I give you a Book and Wisdom; then comes to you a messenger, confirming what is with you; do ye believe in him and render him help." Allah said: "Do ye agree, and take this my Covenant as binding on you?" They said: "We agree." He said: "Then bear witness, and I am with you among the witnesses."

æóÇٕöÐۡ ÃóÎóÐó ٱááøóåõ ãöíËóÜٰÞó ٱáäøóÈöíøöÜۧäó áóãó ÁóÇÊóíۡÊõڪõã ãøöä ڪöÊóÜٰÈöö æóÍößۡãóÉöö Ëõãøó ÌóÂÁóڪõãۡ ÑóÓõæáõõ ãøõÕóÏøöÞõõ áøöãóÇ ãóÚóßõãۡ áóÊõÄۡãöäõäøó Èöåöۧ æóáóÊóäÕõÑõäøóåõۥۚ ÞóÇáó ÁóÃóÞۡÑóÑۡÊõãۡ æóÃóÎóÐۡÊõãۡ Úóáóیٰ Ðóٰáößõãۡ ÇٕöÕۡÑöیۖ ÞóÇáõæۤÇú ÃóÞۡÑóÑۡäóÇۚ ÞóÇáó ÝóٱÔۡÀóÏõæÇú æóÃóäóÇ۫ ãóÚóßõã ãøöäó ٱáÔøóÜٰåöÏöíäó﴿٨١﴾Ýóãóä Êóæóáøóیٰ ÈóÚۡÏó Ðóٰáößó ÝóÃõæúáóÜٰۤٮٕößó åõãõ ٱáۡÝóÜٰÓöÞõæä﴿٨٢﴾

Surah-Al Ahzab : 33:07 ( Prophet Muhammad (S) Also among those who made the Promise )

And when We exacted a promise from the prophets, and from you (O Muhammad) and from Noah and Abraham and Moses and Jesus son of Mary. We took from them a solemn promise

æóÇٕöÐۡ ÃóÎóÐۡäóÇ ãöäó ٱáäøóÈöíøöÜۧäó ãöíËóÜٰÞóåõãۡ æóãöäßó æóãöä äøõæÍöö æóÇٕöÈۡÑóٰåöíãó æóãõæÓóیٰ æóÚöíÓóی ٱÈۡäö ãóÑۡíóãóۖ æóÃóÎóÐۡäóÇ ãöäۡåõã ãøöíËóÜٰÞðÇ ÛóáöíÙóóÇ﴿٧﴾ áøöíóÓۡÜٔóáó ٱáÕøóÜٰÏöÞöíäó Úóä ÕöÏۡÞöåöãۡۚ æóÃóÚóÏøó áöáۡßóÜٰÝöÑöíäó ÚóÐóÇÈðÇ ÃóáöíãóóÇ

Prophet Jesus to help Mahdi the Messenger.

God has taken the Promise from all of the Prophets to help a Messenger. This promise was not made for Prophet Muhammad (SWT) because another verses mentioned above shows that Prophet Muhammad (S) was among those Prophets too who made that promise.

So far we have not seen this promise being tested by God and being fulfilled by any of the Prophets as well. I mean so far No Prophet had borne witness to another Messenger and helped him. If God had not wanted to test this promise to whom he God himself bears witness why would have he taken this promise from all of the Prophets at first place ? –

So It means a lot and confirms that there would be a time when a “ Prophet “ would be tested to help a “ Messenger “ who will confirm the authenticity of his prophet hood and that Prophet would help that messenger to fulfill his promise.

Thus there are Two persons to come yet an Imam Mahdi and a Prophet Jesus (A) so as we know it would be Prophet Jesus (A) who would bear witness to Imam Mahdi and Help him thus in my view Imam Mahdi is the Promised Messenger mentioned in Quran (3:81)

Edited by imran7

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how could one consider Imam Al Mahdi (as) to be a messenger when to be a muslim must believe

that there is only one God (Allah)

and Mohamed (as) is his last messenger

or he would not be considered a musilm

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how could one consider Imam Al Mahdi (as) to be a messenger when to be a muslim must believe

that there is only one God (Allah)

and Mohamed (as) is his last messenger

or he would not be considered a musilm

I am not constituing a Belief and even what i said is not my belief rather that is my research work, supported with logical reasons, and reason for posting it here was to learn more on that Promise mentioned in Quran 3:81 and nothing else.

I didnt' call him Prophet anyway. first read the thread carefully it need proper attention before jumping to conclusions!

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You've got your original premise backwards, and I hope this isn't what you actually profess. Every rasool is a nabi, but not every nabi is a rasool. Therefore, by saying that the Imam is a messenger, one would be saying he was also a prophet, which we know to be incorrect.

It's stuff like this that demonstrate how imperative it is that we not forget to hold onto the teachings of the Ahl al-Bayt in understanding the Book of Allah.

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(salam)

Imran, whereas I can understand your logic , I must say we're treading on thin ice in here.

So be careful :)

Well! again that does not constitue as of my belief just a view and research, supported with logics which could be wrong. However i wanted to explore more on that Promise mentioned in Quran 3:81 right. 2ndly we should consider that there are two distingiush terms used in Quran ' Rasool ' and ' Nabi ' .

When we talk about finality of Prophethood (khatem-e-Nabowat) that means end and no-one will come as a Prophet but does that mean no-one as messenger too I mean there is no term in Quran like (Khatem-e-Mursaleen) Quran says Muhammad is last Prophet ?

General Belief, No one to come, no way someone as a messenger or prophet again like that.

Yet, We believe that Two persons have to come, and Yes yet have to come. One is Imam Mahdi and Other is Prophet Jesus. that is what made me curious. And we see Prophet Jesus to Help to Imam Mahdi while .... what makes the difference if we call Imam Mahdi a messnenger (Rasool) not Prophet.

We know God will give a call as Mahdi emerge and people have to give allegiance to him, so What is different between Imam Mahdi and a messenger of God ?

Edited by imran7

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Salamun Aleykum, I had been countered with the same argument recently and i happened to check Nahjul Balagha Sermon no. 1 which clearly answers the Quranic verse quoted
In this way ages passed by and times rolled on, fathers passed away while sons took their places till Allah deputised* Muhammmad (peace be upon him and his progeny) as His Prophet, in fulfilment of His promise and in completion of His Prophethood. His pledge had been taken from the Prophets, his traits of character were well reputed and his birth was honourable.* The people of the earth at this time were divided in different parties, their aims were separate and ways were diverse. They either likened Allah with His creation or twisted His Names or turned to else than Him. Through Muhammmad (p.b.u.h.a.h.p.) Allah guided them out of wrong and with his efforts took them out of ignorance.

You can notice the pledge had been taken for Prophet swws

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On 8/28/2007 at 5:12 PM, imran7 said:

He said: Surely I am a servant of Allah; He has given me the Book and made me a prophet; {19:30}

This is where I get confused, (As Andres has pointed out in another thread)...translations.

Yusufali19:30 He said: "I am indeed a servant of God: He hath given me revelation and made me a prophet;

Pickthal says "He hath given me the Scripture..." Khalifa too.

This was Jesus as an infant speaking. The NT agrees Jesus was given revelation, but there is no NT reference to any actual book.

Imagine what this book would have been worth. Who would have fought for it, who would have died. How far down through history would have this book been sought out, and how many other books would reference its history? 

I'm thinking there is no way a physical book of such magnatude could have been kept secret until mentioned in the Quran.

 

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 it has been said that when Imam Mahdi (as) will reappear he will teach Islam anew just like the Prophet (S). Those who thought themselves to be Muslims, will be flabbergasted because of the strangeness of the new religion. Therefore, perhaps, on the grounds that what the Imam (as) is propagating is something out of the blue, we might deny him (ATF). Imam al-Sadiq (as) said, "When our Qa'im rises he shall call people anew to Islam and shall guide them to the things that were annihilated and from which people had turned away. He is called Mahdi because he will guide people to the thing from which they have been separated. He is called al-Qa'im because of his rise for the truth.

" al-Irshad, v2, p383; Bihar al-Anwar, v51, p30, Hadith 7.

 

Imam al-Sadiq (as) saying, "When our Qa'im (as) rises he will face the ignorance of people more severe than what the Apostle of Allah (PBUH&HF) faced during the days of al-Jahiliyya." I asked, "Why should it be so?" The Imam replied, "The Apostle of Allah(PBUH&HF) came to people who were worshipping the stones and the carved wood. However, our Qa'im (as) shall come to people who will all interpret the Book of Allah against his interpretation, and will argue with him by that. By Allah, al-Qa'im shall enter his justice inside their houses, just as the heat and the cold enter them."

Kitab al-Ghaiba, al-Nu'mani, p296, Hadith 1.

 

Imam al-Baqir (as) about this matter (i.e., the rising of al-Mahdi (as)). He (as) replied, "Because you expect that it comes to you in a (certain) way, do not deny it (if it happens in another way)."

 

Bihar al-Anwar, v52, p268, Hadith 157.

Imam Sadiq (A) narrates, "When our Qa'im will appear, people will not accept him as he will appear with a youthful visage and a proportional physique. None will be steadfast on him except the one from whom Allah (SWT) had taken a covenant in the first `Aalam-e-dhar."
al-Ghaybah al-Nomani, p.188, h#43

Edited by Ya_isa (as)

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