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ZethaPonderer

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    Shia Islam (Zaidi Branch)
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    Philosophy, History, Spirituality, Mathematics, Film, Animation, Video Games, Computer Programming, Boxing, and... Religion... Yeah

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  1. I have little to zero energy to do anything with my life. I might go bonkers/insane living where I am (it wasn’t my choice to live where I am) so I need a physical activity to engage in. An activity I’ve always had interest in as a kid,

     

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  2. #25 Best Universal Food Base?

    My vote goes for Bread since it has been The Universal Whole Grain IMO that Humanity has always depended on. Rice comes a close second (basically Bread’s 2nd Cousin) while Noodles can be made from both Rice and Whole Grains that make up what Bread is so its by far the most versatile. Types of Bread: Flatbreads (Roti/Naan/Paraatah/Poori), Barley Bread (The Bread Imam Ali (AS) ate the most), Whole Grain Bread, White Bread etc. However, Bread has been a staple food for Humanity IMO so much so that it has earned a symbolic significance within The Abrahamic Religions. Especially in Christianity. Give a man a bread/fish and you feed him for a day; However, if you teach a man how to make bread or how to fish you’ll feed him for a lifetime.
  3. I've been warned by my parents and my community members around me when seeking information for the sole purpose of education I should be very cautious when using Wikipedia and the people who use Wikipedia as a reliable source of information. I've found some interesting information in Reddit that seems like conspiracy theory, but holds up reasonably well if given the chance (currently), Basically the link above will explain to you about what the term "Sayanim" is via the website en.metapedia.org (Don't know for sure of its reliability so consider me skeptical). Try typing the word "Sayanim" in the Wikipedia search entry and Wikipedia doesn't have an entry nor will it give editors to create a topic surrounding this word. Why is one word such a big deal for Wiki Editors to never touch on? I tried typing the word "Sayanim" in the Wikipedia search entry. This is what I get, The page "Sayanim" does not exist. You can ask for it to be created, but consider checking the search results below to see whether the topic is already covered. Strange, but it holds up (Currently). Another website exposes how Wikipedia really is controlled by Zionist Agencies, http://www.ascertainthetruth.com/att/index.php/the-media/who-controls-the-media/429-zionist-control-of-wikipedia However, I have my doubts on this one. The author who made this exposition about Wikipedia being controlled by Zionist Agencies comes from another website called fourwinds10.com who's 'About Us' and 'Our Objectives' I quote, "About Four Winds A huge main website containing: Alternative News and Information encompassing over 23,000 articles covering 140+ separate topics which is updated daily, All the published Phoenix Journals (115) including the ten Phoenix Journals banned by the U.S. Courts, which contain much secret scientific information, All the unpublished Phoenix Journals (126) Basic NESARA information, related news and updates Fourwinds, also, has a sister site (Phoenix Archives) (http://www.phoenixarchives.com ) which contains a complete archive of the Phoenix Journals, Contact Newspapers (1993-99) Phoenix Liberator (1991-93), and Phoenix Journals Express (1990-1991)." "Our objectives are: To reveal the Darkside's secret Plan 2000 for total world control by our present evil world leaders. To reveal to the world's people that Creator God Aton of Light also has a Plan 2000. God Aton and His Forces of Light will not do it for us but will work with us, as we responsibly confront evil in our day and change the "ending of the play." To reveal the evil world leaders' cover-up of off-world humans (our ancestors), who are here in starships in Earth's atmosphere at this time, and who have come with good intent to help us prevent the evil Plan 2000 from being accomplished, and to help us establish the New Age of Enlightenment. To reveal the Truth presently being given to our civilization by the Realms of Light: a. How to change the age-old prophecies, e.g. how to change the ending of this civilization without the prophesied final destruction occurring. b. How to prepare for our future survival, if necessary, against coming Earth changes. c. How to heal ourselves from any disease or ailment by within in combination with those things provided by Creator God for our healing. d. How to have total and permanent protection for ourselves and our families against all darkside energies, entities and technology. e. How to change what is and create our way, through the power of our God-Spirit within. This includes bringing balance and harmony again to our "Mother Earth and ushering in the New Age of Peace and Enlightenment. f. How to assist our Planet Earth in her transition into fifth dimension by 2012. g. How to make our own transition into fifth dimension and the Age of Enlightenment without experiencing physical death and returning to another 3D lifestream. To assist Truthseekers, Lightworkers, and Truthbringers alike in their search for and presentation of Truth. To spread the Truth from Creator God Aton of Light to the "Four Corners of the Planet Earth" via the "Fourwinds" website (http://www.fourwinds10.com) and the Phoenix Archives website (http://www.phoenixarchives.com). The original foundation of Truth upon which Fourwinds rests is that which has been presented by Creator God Aton of Light and the Ascended Masters in the 241 volumes of The Phoenix Journals. These Journals are also known as the "Holy Books of the Lighted Realms." Basically fourwinds10.com seems to be a website dedicated for polytheists in mind (specifically Egyptian) so I'd take caution on this. I've also found this interesting topic as well in ShiaChat, But, the end result is this. Be careful my brothers and sisters in faith which includes: Momin/Saint, Muslim, Christian, Jew (those who oppose Zionism), and those who seek/live up to the Absolutivity of Truth. We don't live in The Age of Ignorance anymore, but now is The Age of Misinformation. May The God of Prophet Abraham/Ibrahim (AS) help us seek knowledge and let it bear fruit for the sole purpose of pleasing Him.
  4. Are there Zaidi Shias in ShiaChat.com?

    Asalaamulayqum @Shah Khan and @TheGreenWanderer. I want to first explain myself just who I am first and foremost before giving out websites that would make a starting ground of seeking information about the Zaidi sect within Shia Islam. I am a Syed in real life and a Zaidi as well. My family descends from the line of The Fourth Imam Zain-ul-Abideen (AS) and takes great pride in their genealogy. Doesn't matter to me though since I could be one of the sons of Prophet Musa (AS) and it wouldn't grant me instant salvation away from Jahnum/Hell. My family and I do our very best to be stern and devout followers of Imam Zain-ul-Abideen (AS) even though we're not perfect. My knowledge on my own Madhab has its limits due to limited information and my family usually don't talk too much about the differences/similarities of the Zaidi Madhab compared to other Madhabs within the Shia Branch of Islam since they believe all Madhabs within the Shia Branch are OK for me to learn from. Be they Hussaini, Jafari, Twelver etc etc. So, please excuse me if I do come across as a mix between a Zaidi and a Jafari since I'm also learning the Jafari Madhab as well since one of my family members is related to the Madhab. I find the Sixth Imam Jafar Sadiq (AS) very admirable and rational with his scientific/philosophical contributions for Humanity. I believe in Prophet Muhammad (SAW) and his 12 Imams (AS): Ali ibn Abi Talib, Hasan ibn Ali, Hussain ibn Ali, Zain-ul-Abideen, Muhammad Baqir, Jafar Sadiq, Musa Qazim, Ali Raza, Muhammad Taqee, Ali Naqee, Hasan Askari, and Muhammad Al-Mahdi. I believe that Imam Muhammad Al-Mahdi (AS) is Hidden in Qiyamat and shall arrive soon alongside Prophet Jesus/Isa (AS) and Prophet Khizr (AS) to battle with The Dajaal. Now that my backstory is out of the way let's get down to business, however I must warn you. Since we live in the Age of Misinformation it is necessary to fact check so please understand where I'm coming from before reading the websites. I have no desire or intention to misinform any of my brothers here. But since finding information about the Zaidi Madhab from a general sense is limited through the internet I did the best I could to find it so we could develop a starting point for seeking information. Let's begin. So, I found a discussion board on Salvation Ark where one of the topics is about Zaidi literature and Hadith Books. I encourage all of my brothers to read this before the website link since it provides what to expect when reading the website they post. http://salvationark.com/salvationark1/index.php/forum/general-discussions/120-zaidi-literature-hadith-books And here's the website in question that has information about the Zaidi/Zaydi/Zaydiyya sect's literatures and hadiths written http://www.tash-ayyu.org/zaydiyya (Please remove the hyphen to check the website) One of the members in Salvation Ark Abu Yusuf posts this about the website in question, "Actually tash-ayyu.org is not (specifically) a Twelver site, at this point it should be considered more as being a pan-Shi`a site focused on translated ancient Shi`i materials into English. This includes Imami material whether Twelver, Waqifi, or Isma`ili, as well as early Zaydi material. I can speak with some confidence on this since I'm the translator/site admin and I'm not a Twelver myself.The intent in translating this is as the above goal stated. For myself though, the further intention is to understand this important text better and figure out what to make of it. I've found that for myself the best way to truly delve into a material is to translate it. Unlike casual reading where you can skip or skim though on areas you might not fully understand, (good) translating forces you to consider each and every word. While I do not consider myself to be specifically Zaydi either, I do regard that there is value in considering this source material from these `Alid authorities. If anything my approach might be closest to Qadi Nu`man al-Maghribi, the Fatimi Isma`ili jurist and scholar, in that he would make use of Imami and Zaydi sources (he would even on occasion quote from al-Qasim ar-Rassi), though I don't consider myself Isma`ili as such either." I hope I don't misinform any of my brothers here. I did the best I could. Be careful.
  5. The Most Honest Arab Muslim on Planet Earth

    So what you’re saying is that this man has zero understanding when it comes to his lack of awareness of his own words. I’m confused was your comment aimed for the man in the video in question or me? Either way, your last statement is a valid and wise point indeed. Too much overuse of the pronoun ‘We’ to the point where it simply loses it’s function and purpose. Well, I don’t really agree with where Youssef Al Husseni (the man in the video) was coming from despite his honesty since he was being too cynical and pessimistic with his claims either way.
  6. Is YHWH the same as Allah?

    Ok the first video I've watched and it was pretty insightful though there are some issues I found, but the last two videos focus too much on David Wood (Christian Apologist) so I'll not bother wasting my time watching this man of all people since he has no empathy to understand basic human nature (AKA a Sociopath). So, I really question if he even is a Christian since Prophet Jesus/Isa (AS) emphasizes greatly on empathy. https://www.compellingtruth.org/Bible-empathy.html The first video I can give my rebuttal for what Joshua Evans strongly emphasizes that a lot of people don't understand and since Joshua Evans studied psychology to back what his major argument is that he had trouble reading the Bible, "An Implicit Statement cannot override an Explicit Statement. An Explicit Statement takes precedence." Joshua Evans (How the Bible Led Me to Islam: The Story of a Former Christian Youth Minister - Joshua Evans, Video Timestamp - 25:30) https://writingexplained.org/implicit-vs-explicit-difference So, its a shame the guy in the first video doesn't explain that in the video directly of what Joshua Evans is saying and instead turns on preach mode at the end to throw verses from the Bible. Don't know if they were explicit statements since most of the verses in the Bible (Especially the New Testament) are implicit? So, we as not only Muslims and Christians need to understand this, but Humanity as a whole to distinguish between Explicit Statements and Implicit Statements when reading our own sacred scriptures or any book for that matter. Overall, I enjoyed this debate with you Mishael . There were some ups and downs, but all in all it was fun and exciting. Sorry if I was a jerk to you, but hey different strokes for different folks and I found your humbleness throughout this debate a refreshing sight. My only wish to The God of Abraham is this, "Provide salvation/redemption for those who believe in you (Momin/Saints), Muslims, Jews, Christians, and those who seek and live up to the Absolutivity of Truth. I don't believe ALL Jews and Christians and those who strive hard to live up to seeking and living up to the Absolutivity of Truth will go to Hell and shall be permitted to Heaven where everything shall be explained. If I am wrong for all my life and deserve to wrought in Hell/Jahanum for all eternity then I'll spend for all eternity worshiping you the way you intend since Human Beings are created for the sole purpose of worshiping you. I aspire to be a believer (Momin/Saint) in God more so than a Muslim despite my position as a sinner." I'm done debating for quite a while, but if you wish to lay your final say on my last debate with you then be my guest. ^_^
  7. Is YHWH the same as Allah?

    *Sigh* There's so much wrong in your points it depresses me since I don't even know where to begin . First of all, Zionism is established as an ideological atheistic movement by the Founding Father Theodor Herzl whom actual religiously devout Jews are opposed to such as The Orthodox, http://www.truetorahjews.org/whatiszionism Plus, I've found this interesting discussion in ShiaChat. Care to take a read? And here's a Jew's personal experience with Zionism, https://www.deiryassin.org/byboard44.html Second, the fact that you only quote the Saana manuscript portion in your comment about the Quranic Manuscript is proof of not only admitting to me that you blissfully turn a blind eye, but shown that you've only begun to read the evidence that is in the website. Did you know that The First Imam Ali ibne Abi Talib (AS) who lived with Prophet Muhammad (SAW) all his life compiled his Manuscript of The Quran at 718/818 AD (From 1st/2nd century After Hijra AH) according to the same website? Sure you make a point that "Maybe" The original Quran and its copies might not exist, but based on this website which shows some of the copies of the Quran that survived before the 11th century Quran you propose at least they were written and preserved in Classical Arabic just as much as the 11th century Quran. The same cannot be said for the previous scriptures like your Bible since it was translated into many different languages other than Hebrew, Greek, and Aramaic. They're bound to be filled to the brim with translation errors and discrepancies based on what these websites suggests so expect some of us Muslims like me to be skeptical on our end if we're having a hard time swallowing the Christian perspective of "Bible has been preserved well" for you have only shown that you preserved the many translations of the translation of what the original scriptures "could've been" into many languages. http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_bibl.htm http://irr.org/todays-bible-real-bible If the prophets of the Ancient Times were never meant to be role models in the first place on the same light as Prophet Jesus/Isa (AS) and Muhammad (SAW) then it only highlights out the justification for Disbelievers that anyone that claims to be a Prophet of The God of Abraham is a Madman/Sorcerer/Magician. Thus, ALL Prophets are Madmen. So the Tribe of Noah and all the tribes of the Ancient times were justified in their position to NEVER follow them since they were still Seeking Knowledge in their respective time to understand their way of life. While a Prophet, a MESSENGER of God, don't need to seek knowledge like us Humans since they have The Divine Knowledge of God on their side to preach the truth. So even the act of the thought of giving into sin and temptation shouldn't be an option for any Prophet of God in the first place. Joshua Evans refuted by Christians? Proof?
  8. I'm curious has this man's arguments he brings been debunked or refuted in any way where Muslims did contribute something Positive for Humanity here and there in the 20th century and even before the previous centuries past other than Negative things? Only 10 Muslim scientists for 1000 years? Really? Please note, the video is 1 year old, but still has significance based on the events that are beginning to transpire.
  9. Is YHWH the same as Allah?

    By that line of logic you're implying on your first statement, your argument is self-defeating. Why? Because if any of the Previous Prophets (AS) of the Ancient Times in Judeo-Christian sources were depicted to be madmen as some of them are really portrayed based on their "wrongdoings" as you claim then what is to stop the argument on the Disbelievers side of the story such as The Tribe of Noah whom were warned by Drunk Prophet Noah (AS) that they were innocent and YHWH was UNJUST to punish them for their wickedness is nothing compared to Prophet Noah's (AS) Major Sin? Why would The Tribe of Noah listen to their Prophet if he was a drunkard in the first place? The Tribe of Sodom and Gomorrah were innocent all along despite their wickedness if Prophet Lot (AS) is going to indulge in incest with his daughters anyway after their destruction. And just because incest was not forbidden for its time doesn't excuse it (The rest of Humanity would've been wiped out long ago if this was the case) and only highlights how incompetent and confused The God of Abraham in Judeo-Christian scriptures really is. The way of "How" the story is "reported" as you state only makes the Disbelievers arguments stronger. Try telling the Full Biblical Story of Lot, David, and Noah to the kids from all faiths and religions and let me know upfront what their reactions would be. No Christian Scholar would tell the full Biblical story of the previous prophets which only brings suspicion according to Joshua Evans in the video. Question the man in the video all you want, you have yet to meet and know the man in person to even tell you of his experience on his Textual Criticism since you're all assertion and no proof since you didn't even bring your evidences to back them up from what you wrote. At least I have the unfortunate nerve to prove that I intend to look at these Prophets as my Role Models, but now that I read the Biblical Story of Lot, David, and Noah, it just makes me appreciate the Quran even more. Like I said, the model Jews and Christians have for their respective Prophets is different than the model Shia Muslims like myself have so if this is what your belief is about these Prophets then so be it. Your belief is your belief and my belief is mine. As for your stance on how you think the oldest Quran dates back 11th century from opposing sources (e.g. Zionism) that might have an agenda to de-legitimize Islam I dare you to read the perspective of The Quranic Manuscripts from Islamic sources, http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/Text/Mss/ But alas, you've shown yourself time and time again that you wish to be firm in your faith and blissfully turn a blind eye, so I really don't believe you'll ever click that since you find ALL Islamic sources biased and misinformed. At least this case can be concluded that although there are some similarities between YHWH and Allah, the two have some notable differences that makes them stand out in many ways.
  10. Is YHWH the same as Allah?

    *Sigh* Now listen Mishael, if you've even bothered to watch the video I linked, the person does point out how the previous scriptures which the Bible represents as a collection of all the previous scriptures of The Word of God through Prophet Jesus/Isa (AS) that were revealed to the Israelites are not the same as they were originally. Meaning that the Bible Christians are working with is endless multiple copies of what the Torah, Injeel, Zabur, and all the previous scriptures revealed "could've been" (Video timestamp, 8:00). Do you Christians have the Aramaic equivalent of it preserved since Prophet Jesus/Isa (AS) not only spoke Greek and Hebrew, but largely spoke Aramaic for his time to his own people? So, The Bible is nothing more to some Muslims like me other than "What The Word of God could've been through the previous prophets" instead of The Legitimate Word of God spoken through Prophet Jesus/Isa (AS) recorded by his stern and stoic disciples. So the evidence you're even bringing is self-defeating for me. The man in the video studied Textual Criticism of the Bible along with the previous scriptures. Furthermore, if Prophet Adam (AS) was created last before Jesus (AS), then that's a weak and baseless argument since all the previous prophets after Adam (AS) weren't created during the creation of Prophet Adam (AS). Thus, Noah was before Adam and was uncreated. Moses was before Adam and was uncreated. Abraham was before Adam and was uncreated. David was before Adam and was uncreated. Solomon was before Adam and was uncreated. Lot was before Adam and was uncreated. Doesn't matter since the model Jews and Christians have of their portrayal of the previous prophets based on the endless multiple copies of their respective scriptures is outright disrespectful, blasphemous, nonsensical and borderline disingenuous Examples: Prophet Lot/Lut (AS) committing Incest (Major Sin) upon his daughters after the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah. Prophet David/Dawud (AS) committing adultery (Major Sin) Propet Noah/Nuh (AS) being an Alcoholic Drunk Nawuzubillah, may The God of Abraham have mercy on my poor deluded miserable soul for what have I just read and pondered through. I would've been a die-hard atheist if I wasn't aware of Islam and only read the previous scriptures. Bless Prophet Muhammad (SAW) and His Family The Ahlul-Bayt for restoring the honor of the previous prophets. I rest my case. Joshua Evans made too many points that are undeniable. Also, I really despise people who only assert but never bring out evidences/proofs to back up their assertions.
  11. Is YHWH the same as Allah?

    First of all @Mishael, I'd like to apologize for my disrespectful behavior throughout all these posts since it has come to my realization that you remained humble and calm throughout your posts. I realized that I focused too much on the little details and not so much on the big picture. You made your point on the many historical biases Islamic sources and authors may have, but it doesn't excuse yours since even the opposer's point of view (aka Romans) will also be just as biased to fit in the "seemingly exaggerated" Christian narratives of your Christian sources. At the end of the day you've proved your point, the historical accounts are all up for debate on this one and simply need to be proven one way or another. Other than that, I would discuss something else that slipped my mind. Not only do I wish to discuss this with you, but it would be relevant to the actual topic at hand. If this is the extent of how you perceive ALL Muslims who think like this about the Christian Theology of The Trinity then allow me to give you the benefit of the doubt. If it is established under the OT that The God of Abraham is One and Only (which would strongly imply that He is "Whole" as well given by the "Only" nature of Him) based on given evidence (Deuteronomy 4:35-39, Deut 6:4, and Psalms 86:10) then what reason does He/It have in the NT to seemingly split His Oneness into 3 entities: The Father, The Son, The Holy Spirit? Is He/It not limiting His immeasurable power by doing so? Why Prophet Jesus/Isa (AS) as the Son of God? Because he came into existence from his virgin mother Mary? Why not Prophet Adam (AS) be the Son of God since he came into existence without the need of a mother and a father and YHWH directly created him? Does that not make his existence superior to Prophet Jesus/Isa (AS)? Case in point, The Christian Trinity makes no sense to Muslims just as much as "some" Jews since it seemingly violates the concept of Monotheism (Tawheed) of The God of Abraham in all respects. This concept of monotheism Christians propose is truly alienating because of the plausibility of the Trinity Theology that was established as a doctrine from the Council of Nicea at 325 AD, ascribing Prophet Jesus/Isa (AS) and The Holy Spirit being equal to YHWH (The Father) which IMO goes against everything the OT YHWH was described being One and Only. Also, I want to leave it with this, This video sums up everything about The Christian Theology being off in every way possible.
  12. Is YHWH the same as Allah?

    Actually Khadijah was born rich and wealthy because of her strong lineage so she was only able to remain rich since she had the necessary monetary benefits to educate herself that no Pagan Arab man, and neither Jews or Christians supporting mass usury for that matter would touch her. Read her history from not only Islamic sources like this, https://www.al-islam.org/articles/khadijah-daughter-khuwaylid-wife-prophet-muhammad-yasin-t-al-jibouri But even from Non-Islamic sources such as The First Muslim: The Story of Muhammad written by Lesley Hazleton.
  13. Is YHWH the same as Allah?

    Also, can you provide more details as to who these authors/writers of the Bible you quote their names were? Biographical Information? Facts? Who were they? Were they devout followers of the "Teachings" of Prophet Jesus/Isa (AS) or did they worshiped him (AS) as being Son of The God of Abraham?
  14. Is YHWH the same as Allah?

    You're also forgetting that not ALL Islamic sources are biased with their own history just as much as not ALL Judeo-Christian sources are biased since they're all striving their best to be unbiased as best as they can. All Humans regardless of their beliefs and creed are striving hard to be as unbiased as possible and if you can't see through that then you're lost and being way too cynical for your own good. Basically, you're being a skeptic just because of being a skeptic. There is no point to it. Why be Christian then when you can be Agnostic based on your sheer unnerving skepticism? At least my skepticism about Judeo-Christian viewpoints are justified based on the Injustice of Ishmael (AS) and the superiority complex The Israelites have shown. Don't get me wrong, I do see some good in the previous scriptures The God of Abraham has sent, but we must understand the Tribal Connotations littered all over the place and how these scriptures during their respective times were written specifically for them in mind. But you made a valid point there that "History is written by those who are Winners". We as Human Beings need to understand the losers side of the History to forge a balanced perspective of the facts. Otherwise, we'll never learn and shall be doomed to repeat the same mistake as the previous tribes that The God of Abraham has previously tested before the Israelites e.g. Tribe of Adam, Tribe of Nuh, Tribe of Ad, Tribe of Thamud, Tribe of Sodom, Tribe of Gomorrah etc etc. So, basically some of us Muslims have a hard time buying the whole "Covenant only established to Prophet Isaac (AS)" when The God of Abraham tested many tribes. Doesn't make the Israelites that special really, when the previous tribes had it worse. Found this interesting Non-Islamic perspective about Pre-Arabia that caught my attention so this might be interesting, http://www.reviewofreligions.org/8577/the-truth-behind-the-untold-story-explaining-the-origins-of-islam-part-i-of-ii/
  15. Is YHWH the same as Allah?

    Worshiping Female Idols =/= Treatment of Woman as being Worse than Animals during the Pre-Islamic Arabia Times which was downright Patriarchy to the core (AKA Sex Objects and being unequal in comparison to a man). The two are mutually exclusive so you can't make that correlation at all. Also, the fact that you even highlighted that out doesn't exactly make your argument stronger. It actually weakens it if you think about it. Do you really think in The Age of Ignorance where Arabs of those times (Polytheists and Atheists) whom were mostly illiterate and uneducated be able to keep track of their own history when they were considered wild donkeys as you state? Wouldn't these Female Idols you pointed out be all scantily clad and sexually objectified? Polytheism always had its roots to portray images of Female Gods as Sex Objects and the Pre-Islamic Arabia times were no exception. If a common average Pre-Arabia woman did not live up to the status quo of her respective time period based on their Female Gods, there would be serious consequences. Only Khadijah was an exception because she was Rich and did not adhere to Polytheism. The poor woman of the Pre-Arabia times on the other hand whom were polytheists or atheists, not so much. Why do you think Prophet Muhammad (SAW) fled to the cave of Hira after witnessing such atrocities that were being committed by the Pagan Arabs during his time? There was no justice, no order, no sense of equality. What did the Jews and Christians that lived there during the Pre-Arabia times do to the majority of Arabs whom some of them descended down from Ishmael (AS)? Nothing, but inflicting mass usury upon the Pagan Arabs including The Hashemite Tribes and taking advantage of their "Free to Roam Untouched" as you state. And you have the nerve to say that The 12 Tribes of Ishmael NEVER went through Hardships just as much as The Israelites? My my aren't we all being disrespectful to each other. Jews and Christians only know so much about The Legacy of Ishmael and his 12 Tribes, but since you portray him (AS) as a Qabil/Cain like figure + Wild Donkeys, should you really be the ones to talk? https://www.al-islam.org/restatement-history-islam-and-muslims-sayyid-ali-ashgar-razwy/arabia-islam https://www.al-islam.org/glance-life-holy-prophet-islam-dar-rah-haqq/chapter-1-pre-islamic-world
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