174 replies to this topic

[siraatoaliyinhaqqun]

Salamalaikum,

From www.tashayyu.org

It has been ordered in the Quran to seek Help from Salat and Sabr and it's tafsir Sabr refers to Rasool Allah saww and Salat refers to Ali a.s.

Seek aid by patience and prayer, and truly it is a hard thing save for the humble.

And His saying Seek aid by patience and prayer, and truly it is a hard thing save for the humble. The humble: the servile in his prayers, the coming (?) upon them, meaning: The Messenger of Allah saww and `Ali a.s.

I know you will argue with (?) but remember that there are many ahadees and in a khutba Moula Ali a.s. while refering to this ayat said: As Sabro Mohammadun Wa Salaato Wilayati.

And there is upon people regarding Iyyaka Nabudu wa iyyaka nastaeen. And let me tell you that among other tafasir we also have a tafseer "Nastaeeno be wilayate Ameerul Momineen"



Muhammad b. Ibrahim b. Ishaq al Taleqani narrated to us; he said: Ahmad b. Muhammad b. Saeed, slave of Bani Hashim informed us from `Ali b. al Hasan b. `Ali b. Faddaal from his father, who said: I asked al Rida, `Ali b. Musa about Bismillah

He said: The saying of the one who says In the Name of Allah is this: I imprint upon my self a trait from the traits of Allah, Mighty and Majestic be He, and this is worship. He said: So I said to him: And what is samah (trait)? He said: The symbol.

^^^ See that Symbol; by saying Ya Ali Madad we only mean Bismillah hir Rahman Nir Raheem as he a.s. is also a symbol. For this you need to do a proper open-minded research with intention of understanding rather than fault finding. And remember, it is Allah azwj who helps in everything big or small and is not tired helping, helps all His creation even if they call Him at the same time and He is the one who Wills, Orders, gets angry, gets Happy, talks, listens, sees and so on so forth.....................and pay attention, read it again the bold part and if you dont understand read it all your life. Maybe perchance you may reflect.

Edited by siraatoaliyinhaqqun, 06 August 2012 - 07:55 AM.

[Vigilare]

Whether there's a chain or not is irrelevant when scholars promote it as being totally authentic and as an Islamic way of worshipping Allah swt:

[Alejandro Sosa]

some shias really do make us look bad.

[Haydar Husayn]

Sayyid Musawi...

It's quite funny that he didn't give a translation when asked for it by the host. Maybe because it sounds a bit dodgy?

Call Ali, who is Manifestor of wonders, Thou shall surely find him helper in your difficulties, all grief and sorrow shall be removed. I submit my temporal wishes to Thee on whom I trust and always referred Thee to bestow fulfillment of temporal wishes. O! Having Thee bestowed support, O! Thee Appointed Wali, All grief and Sorrows will disappear, By Thee by Thy tremendousness
http://www.duas.org/..._ali_kabeer.htm


Regarding it being authentic, I wonder by what criteria that would be when there isn't even a chain for it?

As for his 'Sunni source', here is what it is (ignore the nonsense at the beginning):

Skip to 1:00

Edited by Haydar Husayn, 06 August 2012 - 03:18 PM.

[Shia_Debater]

It's possible that Sayed Musawi made a mistake when quoting that book. There's no proof that he lied. Bear in mind that I personally don't agree with Nade-e Ali so I'm not trying to defend what he is saying - I am defending him.

Also that video has exaggerations such as 'Shia Ayatullat' ... Sayed Musawi back then when the video was made or even currently now isn't an Ayatullah so I don't know where they get this idea from

Edited by Shia_Debater, 06 August 2012 - 03:30 PM.

[Haydar Husayn]

ahlulbayti, on 06 August 2012 - 03:27 PM, said:

did you make this video?
having second opinions lol.hmmm

No, of course I didn't make that video. I would normally be reluctant to post a video like that due to all the rubbish that people will focus on rather than the substance of it, but in this case I judged that it was worth it to show what kind of 'Sunni sources' are often used.

Shia_Debater, on 06 August 2012 - 03:29 PM, said:

It's possible that Sayed Musawi made a mistake when quoting that book. There's no proof that he lied. Bear in mind that I personally don't agree with Nade-e Ali so I'm not trying to defend what he is saying - I am defending him.

Even giving him the benefit of the doubt, the most you can hope for is that he quoted someone else who quoted that book. You would have to hope he hadn't actually checked it for himself.

However, it wouldn't be the first time he has been caught [Edited] making mistakes.

Quote

Also that video has exaggerations such as 'Shia Ayatullat' ... Sayed Musawi back then when the video was made or even currently now isn't an Ayatullah so I don't know where they get this idea from

Like I said, ignore the nonsense. It's made by a Nasibi, so what do you expect? However, that doesn't change the substance of the video.

Edited by inshaAllah, 09 August 2012 - 04:35 AM.

[Ali Musaaa :)]

Alejandro Sosa, on 06 August 2012 - 03:11 PM, said:

some shias really do make us look bad.

That's what hurts me the most

It's reported that Imam Al-Jawad said: "If only the ignorant one remained silent, then there would be no disaccord among the people."

[Shia_Debater]

Haydar Husayn, on 06 August 2012 - 03:41 PM, said:

Even giving him the benefit of the doubt, the most you can hope for is that he quoted someone else who quoted that book. You would have to hope he hadn't actually checked it for himself.

Doesn't matter - either way I will give him the benefit of the doubt.

Quote

However, it wouldn't be the first time he has been caught making things up.

And how do you know he wasn't telling the truth?

[Darth Vader]

To be honest I simply don't get the illogical idea of relying on "hadith science".

- "Hadith science" or Rijalism is not found in any hadith.
- If a hadith has no isnad how do you know it is fabricated.
- A reported "chain of narrators" is a rubbish thing in itself. As if hadiths were always great secrets and only one person from each generation knew and transmitted it to the next generation.

I could go on and on about this but its off topic so it suffices to say that it surprises me that people can not only forge their religion based on "hadith science" but are also able to peddle and sell this garbage to others.

[Haydar Husayn]

Shia_Debater, on 06 August 2012 - 03:56 PM, said:

And how do you know he wasn't telling the truth?

Come on brother, I admire your willingness to give him the benefit of the doubt and everything, but look at that video objectively. Look at his reactions. Do you really think he was telling the truth? Just pretend for a second that it was a debate between two atheists, and tell me who seemed more persuasive.

[Ali Musaaa :)]

Haydar Husayn, on 06 August 2012 - 03:17 PM, said:

Sayyid Musawi...

It's quite funny that he didn't give a translation when asked for it by the host. Maybe because it sounds a bit dodgy?

Call Ali, who is Manifestor of wonders, Thou shall surely find him helper in your difficulties, all grief and sorrow shall be removed. I submit my temporal wishes to Thee on whom I trust and always referred Thee to bestow fulfillment of temporal wishes. O! Having Thee bestowed support, O! Thee Appointed Wali, All grief and Sorrows will disappear, By Thee by Thy tremendousness
http://www.duas.org/..._ali_kabeer.htm


Regarding it being authentic, I wonder by what criteria that would be when there isn't even a chain for it?

As for his 'Sunni source', here is what it is (ignore the nonsense at the beginning):

Skip to 1:00

That was utterly painful to sit through and watch. I feel sorry for the brother interviewing. I am actually glad he didn't translate it, although it would of been better if he didn't even mention that dua of shirk on live television declaring it is authentic...

[Shia_Debater]

Haydar Husayn, on 06 August 2012 - 04:06 PM, said:

Come on brother, I admire your willingness to give him the benefit of the doubt and everything, but look at that video objectively. Look at his reactions. Do you really think he was telling the truth? Just pretend for a second that it was a debate between two atheists, and tell me who seemed more persuasive.

I don't believe Sayed Musawi was lying - although I agree the salafi was more persuasive

[Ali Musaaa :)]

Shia_Debater, on 06 August 2012 - 04:11 PM, said:

I don't believe Sayed Musawi was lying - although I agree the salafi was more persuasive

So you think he genuinely believes the Dua is 100% authentic? If so, why was he so hesitant to give its translation when asked not once but twice for it? I got nothing against this Brother at all, I just think he shouldn't of even mentioned this Dua since he was always going to get asked for a translation as not even the interviewer is Arabic.

[Ali_Hussain]

Ali Musaaa :), on 06 August 2012 - 04:15 PM, said:

So you think he genuinely believes the Dua is 100% authentic? If so, why was he so hesitant to give its translation when asked not once but twice for it? I got nothing against this Brother at all, I just think he shouldn't of even mentioned this Dua since he was always going to get asked for a translation as not even the interviewer is Arabic.

I think he was talking about the second video where the guy (seemingly) made up a story about an event centered around a book, whose content didn't seem to match the story.

[Ali Musaaa :)]

Ali_Hussain, on 06 August 2012 - 04:20 PM, said:

I think he was talking about the second video where the guy (seemingly) made up a story about an event centered around a book, whose content didn't seem to match the story.

Ah okay, that must of been the clip in Arabic? If so, sorry S_D I didn't know.

[Kaniz e Zahra]

Ali Musaaa :), on 06 August 2012 - 04:06 PM, said:

That was utterly painful to sit through and watch. I feel sorry for the brother interviewing. I am actually glad he didn't translate it, although it would of been better if he didn't even mention that dua of shirk on live television declaring it is authentic...

Everybody else is mushrik,only this little band has found Tauheed after centuries.

[Ali Musaaa :)]

Kaniz e Zahra, on 06 August 2012 - 04:33 PM, said:

Everybody else is mushrik,only this little band has found Tauheed after centuries.

What are you talking about? I never said anyone was a Mushrik. It's a dua that reeks of shirk. Whether you like to hear that or not, it's a fact,

[Vigilare]

Kaniz e Zahra, on 06 August 2012 - 04:33 PM, said:

Everybody else is mushrik,only this little band has found Tauheed after centuries.

Salaam,

Do you think that everything that is written and everything that is said by scholars is true or valid?

[Kaniz e Zahra]

Ali Musaaa :), on 06 August 2012 - 04:44 PM, said:

What are you talking about? I never said anyone was a Mushrik. It's a dua that reeks of shirk. Whether you like to hear that or not, it's a fact,

It does n't reek any shirk,only if you think it does n't become fact.

Vigilare, on 06 August 2012 - 04:45 PM, said:

Salaam,

Do you think that everything that is written and everything that is said by scholars is true or valid?

W/salaam,
I have n't bothered to watch the video,who cares what it was about.

Edited by Kaniz e Zahra, 06 August 2012 - 04:56 PM.

[Vigilare]

Kaniz e Zahra, on 06 August 2012 - 04:56 PM, said:

It does n't reek any shirk,only if you think it does n't become fact.

W/salaam,
I have n't bothered to watch the video,who cares what it was about.

It was a general question, although to add I would say in relation to the teachings of the Prophet and the Imams .

[Kaniz e Zahra]

Vigilare, on 06 August 2012 - 05:03 PM, said:

It was a general question, although to add I would say in relation to the teachings of the Prophet and the Imams .

ok.

[Al-Afasy]

Quote

# Reciting Naad-e-Ali 1000 times in one sitting will result
in fulfillment of any legitimate desire.

I'd feel bad for the guy who recites this wanting his need fulfilled,  just to find out on the day of judgement that he's going to hell for Shirk....

Edited by Al-Afasy, 06 August 2012 - 05:32 PM.

[Chaotic Muslem]

http://www.aqaed.com/faq/6101/
it is a poetry according to the Marje'yah aqa'ed research center , it was not narrated from any ma'soom