47 replies to this topic

[Al-Mufeed]

http://english.alara.../21/215565.html

Quote

Egypt’s top Islamic cleric on Monday denounced Shi’ite houses of worship in an usual outburst against the Muslim sect, telling Iran’s envoy in Cairo that the husseiniyas promoted “instability.”

Ahmed al-Tayyeb, the imam of the prestigious Sunni Al-Azhar institute, met with the envoy a day after scholars from Al-Azhar and Islamist groups issued a statement condemning what they said were attempts to spread Shiism in Egypt.

Shiites are estimated as a tiny fraction of Egypt’s population of 82-million, most of them Sunni Muslim. Shiism is dominant in Iraq and Iran, a regional rival to Egypt and the conservative Gulf monarchies.


Tayyeb told the envoy that Al-Azhar “rejected any husseiniya in Egypt because of their negative effects in destabilizing the country and fracturing unity and weakening the national fabric,” Al-Azhar said in a statement.

Sunnis have traditionally opposed Shiism, which teaches that many of the Prophet Mohammed’s companions revered by Sunnis were corrupt and usurped power from his rightful successor and cousin, Ali.

“We are not against Shiism. They can do whatever they want in their countries, but if we are to draw closer to them, we don’t want to hear insults against the companions,” Mahmoud Azab, Tayyeb’s dialogue adviser, told AFP.

Over the past decades, Al-Azhar has tried to promote a measure of reconciliation between the two streams of Islam, recognizing Shi’ite jurisprudence as legitimate.

But the sect remains taboo in Egypt, partly because of its association with Iran, which has low-level diplomatic representation in Cairo after Egypt broke off ties following Iran’s 1979 Islamic revolution.

In a recent debate ahead of a May 23-24 presidential election, one front-runner, Abdel Moneim Abul Fotouh, said Shiism must not be allowed to enter Egypt, while another candidate has been forced to battle rumors that he secretly embraced Shiism.

Azab told AFP that Tayyeb’s statements were prompted by reports of a husseiniya built in a Cairo suburb which has an Iraqi expatriate community.

“It is reported -- almost confirmed -- that there was a husseiniya in the October 6 (suburb) and the people were unhappy about it,” he said.

According to sources, Egyptian authorities shut down the husseiniya, which was reportedly opened by Lebanese Shi’ite cleric Ali al-Korani during his recent visit to Cairo.

The sources told Al Arabiya that the authorities confiscated all publications, posters and recordings found in the mosque.

[Saintly_Jinn23]

Of course, I understand he is saying "Husseiniya" but I think it's funny he objects to places of worship explicitly Shia considering where he works.

Edited by Saintly_Jinn23, 21 May 2012 - 03:53 PM.

[Propaganda_of_the_Deed]

Compared to a lot of other Sunni Arab countries, Egyptians generally have a lot of outward displayed love for the ahlul bayt - especially given the history of their country has with them, and their Fatimid past and some shrines that many believe are of members of the Prophet's family. It is believed by many there, as a Fatimid legacy, that Zeinab a.s is buried at the Sayyidah Zaynab Mosque, and that the head of Imam Hussain a.s is located at the al-Hussein Mosque both in Cairo. The Al Azhar's official stance is also that the Jafari mathab is a legit mathab which is also taught there.

Edited by Propaganda_of_the_Deed, 21 May 2012 - 03:55 PM.

[Thurston]

More unity please.

[Rasul]

Sunnis dont know what to do...  many Sunnis have converted to Shiism in Egypt

maybe Sunni Wahhabi Unity <+?

[shiaaliibrahim]

Egypt is scared of the spread of Ahlul Bayt in that country.  In the last 30 years the Shia community from what I have read and have been told has grown from almost zero to 2 million people.  That has to be scary to the Jahil forces running that country.  Unfortunately, there appears to be a tide rising in the world to rollback the gains that the Ahlul Bayt school of thought have made in recent years.

[Rasul]

shiaaliibrahim, on 21 May 2012 - 04:54 PM, said:

Egypt is scared of the spread of Ahlul Bayt in that country.  In the last 30 years the Shia community from what I have read and have been told has grown from almost zero to 2 million people.  That has to be scary to the Jahil forces running that country.  Unfortunately, there appears to be a tide rising in the world to rollback the gains that the Ahlul Bayt school of thought have made in recent years.

Salam

Yes many Sufis has also converted to Shiism

[one2look4]

Most ewgyptian shia have fallen pray to dajjal ahmad hassan yamani

[Rasul]

one2look4, on 21 May 2012 - 05:56 PM, said:

Most ewgyptian shia have fallen pray to dajjal ahmad hassan yamani

That's not true

there is an little deviant group

may Allah curse them

[AlAbd AlThaleel]

Rasul, on 21 May 2012 - 06:05 PM, said:

That's not true

there is an little deviant group

may Allah curse them

May Allah (swt) curse him, and guide them, and us .

[AR2011]

hostility against shias is growing in egypt partly because of the immigration of a large no. of shia iraqis to egypt because of the instability in iraq and this has rocked their boat a bit because more and more egyptians are converting to shia.

[Noura]

Can Sunnis build masjids in Iran were they can try to "convert" shia's to sunnism or salafism, can the people of az zahar send missionaries to Iran or Iraq to "convert" shia? And hopefully with democracy the powers of ignorance are destroyed and Egyptians become a religious or atheist ? And the slight growth of shiaism was because of Nasrallah and Hezbollah, because the Egyptians are the most ardent people in their support of the Palestinians but with nasrallah slide in popularity because of his stances on Syria shiaism growth in Egypt will not be that much.

[Qa'im]

Modern Egypt does not have much experience with sectarian factions; all the Muslims there are Sunni Shafi`i Arabs who mostly live in the same few cities. The only real division is Muslim and Copt; but otherwise, a Sunni-Shi`i divide hasn't existed. They are unlike other Middle Eastern countries in the sense that the population is not as religiously diverse. Lately, there has been a surge of Salafism and Sufism in Egypt, which are theological opponents to each other. Salafism is directly opposed to Shi`ism, while Sufis there are more varied (some positive, some negative, most are indifferent). So this opposition to new Shi`a masajid does not surprise me; it's foreign to them and they are prone to all the old stereotypes that Sunnis have.

What's interesting though is that they won't tolerate a group that is critical of companions, but they will tolerate Egyptians that are critical of Muhammad and Islam (and very open about it), as well as atheists and nonbelievers. It really shows where their priorities are. May Allah guide them and give the school of Ahl al-Bayt a home in Egypt.

[ShiaBen]

Noura, on 21 May 2012 - 07:46 PM, said:

Can Sunnis build masjids in Iran were they can try to "convert" shia's to sunnism or salafism, can the people of az zahar send missionaries to Iran or Iraq to "convert" shia? And hopefully with democracy the powers of ignorance are destroyed and Egyptians become a religious or atheist ? And the slight growth of shiaism was because of Nasrallah and Hezbollah, because the Egyptians are the most ardent people in their support of the Palestinians but with nasrallah slide in popularity because of his stances on Syria shiaism growth in Egypt will not be that much.

Since when did a mosque become Shiite or Sunni?

[ABA]

Any one that does this identifies themselves to be an agent of the Saudi Royal Family or Israel.  Denouncing Shia is a game of the Saudi Royal family and Israel.  It's that simple.

[Propaganda_of_the_Deed]

ShiaBen, on 21 May 2012 - 08:17 PM, said:

Since when did a mosque become Shiite or Sunni?

I've noticed this rhetorical question gets passed around easily on here anytime that point is raised. It is either being in denial or naive, because ideally, yes a masjid is a place of worship of Allah swt. However if you have been to both a "Sunni" masjid and a "Shia" one, you would know there are stark differences, especially when it comes to congregational salah behind the imam.

There are also relevant events and programs that are more likely to occur within a masjid that is affiliated with a certain sect. You wont find ashura commemorations and wiladats etc at a Sunni masjid, just as you would be hard pressed to find congregational Tarawih led by an imam at a Shia one.

Since when did Muslims become Sunni and Shiite? one could ask further. There was once a time when just being a Muslim sufficed.

Edited by Propaganda_of_the_Deed, 21 May 2012 - 08:37 PM.

[Ugly Jinn]

Quote

“We are not against Shiism. They can do whatever they want in their countries, but if we are to draw closer to them, we don’t want to hear insults against the companions,” Mahmoud Azab, Tayyeb’s dialogue adviser, told AFP.

Seems reasonable.

This forum is proof enough.

[Noura]

how does a person "convert" to shiaism ?

[Propaganda_of_the_Deed]

Noura, on 21 May 2012 - 10:15 PM, said:

how does a person "convert" to shiaism ?

It could be better phrased as adopting the Jafari mathab.

[Chris]

Egypt is heading towards extremism.

Today they also sentenced 12 Christians to life in prison for defending themselves against the crazy violent Salafists, all 8 terrorist Salafists were acquitted.  Do remember the Coptic massacre last year when the army mowed down 26 unlucky Copts who were oddly protesting against a church massacre a day prior in Alexandria.

What is happening in the Arab world is sickening.  We are seeing well financed Salafists taking over just about everywhere, very dangerous trend in my opinion.  I don't know how the Egyptian sees a Shia, but I do know that many see Coptics as subhuman second class citizens.  If the El Ekhwen gets in, I hear they will impose Jiyza tax on their subordinates.

[Noah-]

Shias should ban Sunnis mosques in Iraq and Iran because they praise the killers of Ahlul Bait and Sahaba in their mosques such as Muhawiya, Abu Sufiyan, Hinda, Yazeed and many more. They view the parents of Prophet Mohammad as nonbelievers. They declare Abu Talib as nonbelievers. They insult Shias and our beliefs. As this lunatic Shaikh said, they should go to Sunni countries to do so, not in Shia countries.

If we are cursing Muhawiya or others whom they find them dear, they are declaring the ones we consider good Muslims as nonbelievers.

Most Sunnis will never see the just way, never use logic and never know anything about a balance and fairness. Anything that suits them and logical according to their own ways and thinking, that is what they expect to impose and demand.

[Noah-]

Noura, on 21 May 2012 - 07:46 PM, said:

Can Sunnis build masjids in Iran were they can try to "convert" shia's to sunnism or salafism, can the people of az zahar send missionaries to Iran or Iraq to "convert" shia?

1. How quickly you forgot the history. Egypt and most of North African regions were Shia Ismailia initially, weren't they? They were converted to Sunnism (mostly by force). Why now you cry if 'a few' converts back to Shia Islam?

2. He is declaring a ban on Shia mosques. Not a Shia center that does missionary works. It has nothing to do with Qom or Al-Azhar or Iranians. It is about the mosques for Shia Egyptians, the same way Sunnis have thousands of mosques in their own areas in Iraq and in Iran and practice their religion freely. You as 'a so called' secular really amaze me by such declaration and biased and unjust comparisons.

3. Read the history of Al-Azhar (see how it became Sunni).

4. On YouTube you can check the 'BBC Arabic interview' clips of the current Tunisian political leader, Rashid al-Ghannush, the head of Ennahda Movement who explain how the entire north African regions were [forced] converted to Sunni Islam from Shia Islam.....and that there is no big deal or a huge problem if a few Sunnis convert back to Shia Islam.

5. There is no problem if a few Shias in Iran convert to Sunni Islam. Most of today's Iran was Sunni initially as well. And there are cases where some did convert to Sunni Islam in the past 4 decades.

Edited by Noah-, 22 May 2012 - 12:17 AM.

[hasanhh]

Al-Mufeed, on 21 May 2012 - 03:42 PM, said:

http://english.alara.../21/215565.html

This appears to me as the rantings of someone unsure of himself .

[Propaganda_of_the_Deed]

Noah-, on 22 May 2012 - 12:13 AM, said:

1. How quickly you forgot the history. Egypt and most of North African regions were Shia Ismailia initially, weren't they? They were converted to Sunnism (mostly by force). Why now you cry if 'a few' converts back to Shia Islam?

Time is relative, how far back do you want to go? Initially, before the rise of the Fatimids in North Africa (which was from the year 909 in Algeria to 1171 in Egypt), the region was Sunni.

Egypt was part of the early Islamic invasions, Amr ibn Aas was sent by Omar ibn al Khattab as early as 639. By the early 8th century, pretty much all of North Africa was consolidated by Umayyad rule, after which they would go onto Spain in the year 711.

And if you want to go back even farther in time, initially the region was under Byzantine Christian rule.

[south-lebanon]

All this talk about "shia revival" in Egypt is doubtful, I seriously doubt whether there is anymore that 50.000 shias (probably expat iraqis,Lebs) in the entire population of Egypt. I have heard claims that  vary between 1 million to 10 million shias in Egypt, if that's true, then where are they?, where did they vote?, where are their candidates. It seems people are falling for the old divide and conquer propaganda of the Wahhabis. It seems the wahabis and their agents only want to make out that the shias are infiltrating Egypt and changing their society because really what they fear is the awakening of a free thinking Egyptian population, which is very dangerous for the Saudis and the zionist state, who are both apart of the same axis... they want to keep the population of Egypt  pre-occupied with the Shia, rawafid, majoosi, safawid boogeyman to keep their influence strong and to safeguard their thrones while giving their population a false sense of being "under-siege".

I'm surprised shias are not awake to this, as they keep entertaining the western/wahabi propaganda of a so-called "shia revival" in the Sunni world.

Edited by south-lebanon, 22 May 2012 - 05:12 AM.