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Serious Problems In Russia Vote

Russian elections putin

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#1 Propaganda_of_the_Deed

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 07:41 AM

Foreign observers: serious problems in Russia vote

By JIM HEINTZ and PETER LEONARD - Associated Press



MOSCOW -- The head of the major international election observer mission in Russia says there were "serious problems" in the vote that returned Vladimir Putin to the presidency.

Tonino Picula said in a statement Monday that "there was no real competition, and abuse of government resources ensured that the ultimate winner of the election was never in doubt."

Picula headed the short-term observer mission of the Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe.

A brief synopsis of the mission's findings did not address Russian independent observers' contentions that there were widespread cases of people casting multiple ballots, but said the election "process deteriorated during the vote count, which was assessed negatively in almost one-third of polling stations observed."

The Central Elections Commission says Prime Minister Putin, who was president in 2000-2008, got more than 63 percent of the nationwide vote, but the independent Russian elections watchdog Golos says incomplete reports from its observers of individual polling station counts indicate he hovered perilously close to the 50-percent mark needed for a first-round victory.

The OSCE observers' conclusions may have significant bearing on whether Russia's opposition forces will be able to maintain the momentum of the unprecedentedly large protests they were able to marshal in the past three months.

A protest rally has been set for Monday evening on Moscow's Pushkin Square, one of the central city's most iconic locations. News reports say some 12,000 police and troops will be on duty to ensure order in the city.

The recent months' protests were the largest public show of anger in post-Soviet Russia, where opposition demonstrations previously had been severely limited by officials, and any unauthorized gatherings were harshly dispersed by police.

However, officials gave permission for the massive rallies, which attracted tens of thousands, but it was not clear if the tolerance would continue in the post-election period.

On Monday, outgoing President Dmitry Medvedev ordered the Justice Ministry to present its explanation for last year's rejection of registration for the People's Freedom Party, an organization led by some of the opposition's most prominent figures. He also ordered the prosecutor-general to re-examine the legality of the conviction of imprisoned former oil tycoon Mikhail Khodorkovsky and more than 30 others regarded by the opposition as political prisoners.

Some observers saw the move as a maneuver to vitiate continued protests.

Medvedev, "it appears, is trying in advance to break the protest wave, " political analyst Pavel Svyatenkov was quoted as saying by the ITAR-Tass news agency.

At least one opposition figured vowed that strategy wouldn't work.

In general, this step can be welcomed. But I don't think it should stop the criticism of authorities," Left Front leader Sergei Udaltsov told the state news agency RIA Novosti.


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Vote-rigging, protest 'crackdown': Foreign press on Putin’s victory


Voting in Russia has been marred by widespread fraud and violations and Vladimir Putin might find it hard to rule the country he has transformed: that is the verdict the foreign press passed on the outcome of Russia’s presidential elections.

A number of foreign news outlets highlighted alleged violations and vote-rigging at the polling stations during the presidential vote on Sunday.

British daily The Guardian, citing independent monitors and opposition activists, reported numerous falsifications, including ballot-stuffing and so-called “carousel” voting, when groups of voters move from one polling station to another, casting their ballots repeatedly. Many also referred to reports of the illegal use of absentee ballots, and quoted opposition activists who said that with such a rigged victory, Vladimir Putin could not be considered a legitimate leader.

"It's not an election," the Wall Street Journal cited Aleksey Navalny, the anti-corruption blogger and activist, as saying. "Putin had a chance to make at least the counting fair, but he didn't. Tomorrow we'll wake up in a country where a large chunk of society doesn't see Mr. Putin as a legitimate president."  

Following Sunday’s poll Vladimir Putin, who won a landslide victory, will have to deal with a country which has changed greatly since the moment he first came to power, the Washington Post believes.

While back in the 2000s “Russians were impoverished” and “uncertain” of what lay ahead for the country, now a “more prosperous middle class” is becoming increasingly unhappy with the ongoing situation, says the newspaper.

“Putin <…> finds himself in unfamiliar circumstances,” the report says. “Since December, he has been the target of huge demonstrations in which many thousands have found the courage and solidarity to speak out against him. The outcome of Sunday’s election is unlikely to quell their demands for an honest government that listens to them.”

The newspaper adopted a cautious tone, saying it is still unclear how Vladimir Putin will react to growing anger over alleged election fraud. It said that while Putin might decide to “crack down” on the opposition, the option of the “autocratic regime” bringing in gradual reforms might also be on the table.

As for the Russian protest movement itself, the election results will present it with a serious test of endurance, another newspaper, the Wall Street Journal believes.
“The loosely organized protest movement now faces a test of its ability to keep up the pressure, starting with a Monday evening rally in downtown Moscow,” the report said.

The British Daily Mail newspaper cited former Soviet leader Mikhail Gorbachev’s calls for opposition groups and opponents of Putin not to surrender.

“These are not going to be honest elections, but we must not relent,” Gorbachev was quoted as saying. “Honest elections should be our constant motto for years to come.”

­Middle class as Russia’s new political reality

­Unlike the anxious musings of its British and American counterparts, the German magazine Der Spiegel noted signs of warming of the political climate in Russia. The magazine said that despite its harsh criticism of the opposition, the Kremlin gave a platform to the opposition on election night.

The magazine noted that despite losing to the veteran Communist politician Gennady Zyuganov, independent candidate Mikhail Prokhorov stands as a “second winner” in the presidential race. Following the elections, the businessman was allowed on a number of talk shows, as a “consolation prize” to “disappointed liberals”. Der Spiegel even cited rumors stating that Putin might appoint Prokhorov as his prime minister an “olive branch to the rebellious middle class.” However the billionaire candidate has already said he would not accept the post.

The French daily Le Figaro declared that a new opposition had emerged in Russia which Vladimir Putin would have to deal with. “This movement expresses the aspirations of the new urban middle class, which by its very existence demonstrates the main achievement of the Putin era – taking Russian society out of Soviet poverty,” the paper said. “But the protest expresses despair over the rigid political system.” Following his victory, Vladimir Putin will have to launch a widespread modernization program which will imply openness and a refusal to follow the old Cold War era strategies the Kremlin still pursues, said the newspaper.

Preliminary results show a decisive win for Vladimir Putin in Sunday’s presidential elections. The vote was preceded by a wave of demonstrations to demand fair and transparent elections following the parliamentary poll of December 4, 2011.  Protesters claimed the vote, which brought the ruling United Russia party a reduced Duma majority, was rigged.  

Despite opposition criticism and reports of widespread vote-rigging on Sunday, a number of foreign observers, including Finnish, Italian, Serbian and Bulgarian nationals, said the poll had been without serious violations, Itar-Tass news agency reports. Some lauded the video monitoring system installed to make the elections more transparent as “exceeding all international standards.”

Click here for full election coverage

­Zhanna Budenkova, RT

Edited by Propaganda_of_the_Deed, 05 March 2012 - 07:42 AM.

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#2 Ya Aba 3abdillah

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 08:39 AM

lol, this was the most open election in russia's history, and every ballot box had a live web cam recording it. People in Russia remember the Yeltsin years, then they remember what Putin did for them, they voted for the man that gave them honour again. Is that a crime?

Even if he is at the helm for a combined total of 50 years, if that's what the people want, that's what the people should get. It's amusing how elements in the West are complaining against democracy.

شبعا، هونين، ابل القمح، قدس، المالكية، تربيخا، صلحا، النبي يوشع - القدس


SHAME on the those who exploit the tragedy of Her Majesty Fatimah Al-Zahraa' (as) to create hate and sectarian discord! You are a SHAME to Her, to Her Father and to Islam!
Ya Shahid Al-Sadr - You lived like Muhammad. You fought like Ali. And you died like Hussain!
Save the Middle East & Declare Jihad Against Sectarianism!

#3 Ruq

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 08:46 AM

I saw a pic of Putin shedding a tear. I think maybe it was more to do with the cold and his face lift being a little tight rather than joyful surprise :mellow:

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#4 Ya Aba 3abdillah

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 08:51 AM

View Post~Ruqaya, on 05 March 2012 - 08:46 AM, said:

I saw a pic of Putin shedding a tear. I think maybe it was more to do with the cold and his face lift being a little tight rather than joyful surprise :mellow:

The man is a nationalist, and the nation overwhelmingly supported him, maybe he was a little overcome by emotion because of their belief in him? Or perhaps he's not permitted to be emotional? hmmmm

شبعا، هونين، ابل القمح، قدس، المالكية، تربيخا، صلحا، النبي يوشع - القدس


SHAME on the those who exploit the tragedy of Her Majesty Fatimah Al-Zahraa' (as) to create hate and sectarian discord! You are a SHAME to Her, to Her Father and to Islam!
Ya Shahid Al-Sadr - You lived like Muhammad. You fought like Ali. And you died like Hussain!
Save the Middle East & Declare Jihad Against Sectarianism!

#5 Ruq

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 10:07 AM

Maybe :unsure:

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#6 kadhim

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 02:24 PM

Propagandist, can you explain why you are so obsessed with the elections of foreign countries? If you're so concerned with the democratic process, get out from behind the keyboard and promote it in your own country. Surely you have better things to do than to propagate muckraking against the official muckraking target du jour?

#7 Ruq

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 02:56 PM

^ Its just a topical news item. At least its not another Syria thread.

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#8 baradar_jackson

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 03:17 PM

"Fraud elections"... this seems to be the new style

It seems all sorts of color revolutions are attempted using this as a springboard.

I'm surprised they're going after Russia. Russians already fell victim to these plots in recent history (with perestroika), why would they fall for it again?

#9 bolbol

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 03:49 PM

Fraud elections is code word from the Washington regime to tell their cronies: stand up to your government, kill if you must, we're behind you, until it's overthrown.

#10 Propaganda_of_the_Deed

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 05:17 PM

View Postkadhim, on 05 March 2012 - 02:24 PM, said:

Propagandist, can you explain why you are so obsessed with the elections of foreign countries? If you're so concerned with the democratic process, get out from behind the keyboard and promote it in your own country. Surely you have better things to do than to propagate muckraking against the official muckraking target du jour?

And here's me trying to not be biased and show articles dealing with Russian elections and not just those of Iran.

There is clearly no pleasing some.

By the way, if you refer back to the original post, you will find 2 sets of articles, one by Associated Press.. and the second was by Russia Today :o (pay particular attention to the last paragraph) so the thread isn't exactly one-sided.

Besides, I've only done 2 threads dealing with elections including this... hardly would call that "obsessed", maybe you're reading too much into things that aren't really there?

Edited by Propaganda_of_the_Deed, 05 March 2012 - 05:20 PM.

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"If you find yourself alone, riding in the green fields with the sun on your face, do not be troubled.

For you are in Elysium, and you're already dead!"



Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.

~ Charles Patterson

#11 ShiaBen

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 05:25 PM

Unfortunately, there's nobody better than Putin.

He's done more for the nation than garbage like Gorbachev and Yeltsin which robbed and retarded and deprived it of survival.

#12 baradar_jackson

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 06:26 PM

Just an interesting note to consider when wondering about what Russians -- collectively -- think. The most well-liked Russian leader in modern history, is Joseph Stalin:



#13 bolbol

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 07:54 PM

lol@ how the NATO rat channel uses "Carnegy Institute", an American endorsed institution to do their bidding on educational and political matters to promote their propaganda.

Stalin was a loved leader, and a puppy compared to American and British regimes during that era. Stalin's reputation is simply highlighted because of the victor.


That will change in the future.

.

Edited by bolbol, 05 March 2012 - 07:56 PM.


#14 Noah-

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 08:11 PM

View Postkadhim, on 05 March 2012 - 02:24 PM, said:

Propagandist, can you explain why you are so obsessed with the elections of foreign countries?

That is not true; he is only interested in elections of those countries who are not 'Saudis' or 'Western' friends. However, Russia is friendly towards the West in the last 12 years, but since it vetoed the resolution against Syria, it gives Mr. Propaganda enough reasons to reject Russian election.

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#15 Abu Muslim

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 08:18 PM

Why must people assume that the brother, Propaganda of the deed, believes the elections were fraud? This is just news. As for me, I don't believe there was fraud in the elections. If supporters of Putin can put in multiple ballots then what prevents opposition from doing the same?

#16 kadhim

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 09:20 PM

View PostNoah-, on 05 March 2012 - 08:11 PM, said:



That is not true; he is only interested in elections of those countries who are not 'Saudis' or 'Western' friends. However, Russia is friendly towards the West in the last 12 years, but since it vetoed the resolution against Syria, it gives Mr. Propaganda enough reasons to reject Russian election.

Well, let's not be unfair here. After all, those Western friend middle eastern nations DON'T HAVE elections, so we could never really test this theory of yours, could we? ;)

#17 Marbles

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 10:45 PM

View Postbaradar_jackson, on 05 March 2012 - 06:26 PM, said:

Just an interesting note to consider when wondering about what Russians -- collectively -- think. The most well-liked Russian leader in modern history, is Joseph Stalin

That just goes on to show that Russians - collectively - are complete nutjobs. It would be akin to Germans - collectively - endorsing the life and times of Adolph H., or Iranians - collectively - nostalgic about the Shah.

Something to be condemned rather than applauded.

Edited by Marbles, 05 March 2012 - 10:46 PM.


#18 baradar_jackson

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Posted 05 March 2012 - 11:29 PM

View PostMarbles, on 05 March 2012 - 10:45 PM, said:

That just goes on to show that Russians - collectively - are complete nutjobs. It would be akin to Germans - collectively - endorsing the life and times of Adolph H., or Iranians - collectively - nostalgic about the Shah.

Something to be condemned rather than applauded.

I don't think that's a correct analogy.

Hitler ultimately brought about the ruination of Germany. What was the outcome of his rule? Yeah, Germany may have conquered all of Europe (through force and genocide), but that was short-lived. What followed that short period of domination, was a series of humiliations and hardships: the annihilation of Dresden and Hamburg, the conquest of Berlin, and today... a culture of self-hatred. Because of crimes that Germany committed during World War II (crimes which were hardly specific to them), forever Germans will be taught to hate their history. This is the outcome of Hitler's rule.

Mammad Reza Shah, I won't even comment. He was just a typical petty Third World dictator. We shouldn't even be talking about him; that's how irrelevant he was. It's an insult to evil, to call him evil. He was weak and abject. Not a villain so much as a sad victim and a pawn.

Stalin neither brought about the ruination of Russia, nor was he a typical puppet leader. So one cannot put him in the same category as either Hitler or Mammad Reza Shah.

The reason why Russians like Stalin, is simple. It was under his rule that Russia became powerful. Russia had long been mazloom; it had been hungry and barefoot. It was never looked upon as an equal by the European countries. Even though Tsar Nicholas II was cousins with King George V, Slavs were always portrayed as an inferior race. (You can even see this today; Hollywood's treatment of Russians, is comparable to its treatment of Arabs and Muslims). The lifestyle in Russia, was a harsh one (not very European at all). And thus, Russia always was made to look up to its European neighbors.

Under Stalin, Russia achieved economic growth through every year of the economic depression which deeply affected Europe and the United States. (The only country to do so). It conquered its historical enemy; Germany. It became a world power capable of challenging the whole world on its own. Its ideals inspired a worldwide legion of taqlidis: it reached the point that any country which had a socialist revolution, also adopted Russian culture!! Even if they started opposing Soviet stances in international politics, they continued to wear Russian clothing (ushankas, fufaikas, and the like), and continued to play the balalaika. (Look at China and the DPRK even today.)

Now if you ask me personally, I don't think any of this justifies admiring the man; even if you are Russian. Stalin did not stand for truth and justice; a leader who does not stand for truth and justice, should not be admired. Moreover, national chauvinism is wrong in principle, and the reasons I have listed above are all chauvinistic reasons. But my opinion is irrelevant. Russians value these things, and it is up to Russians to decide the fate of Russia. And it is a shame that many in the world reject the outcome of democracy when it works against their favor.

Edited by baradar_jackson, 05 March 2012 - 11:31 PM.


#19 Marbles

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Posted 06 March 2012 - 12:04 AM

^ I knew already this explanation was coming. And yeah, I quite agree with its impulse *horror*

None the less, Russians admiring a brutal despot, not abroad but at home, lays bare the craziness of one-dimensional nationalistic rhetoric. Comparatively, albeit on a smaller scale, the modernising efforts of Saddam Hussein for Iraq are also significant. He improved the lot of rural and remoter places of the country through a massive - and largely successful - effort in infrastructure development. No Iraqi leader before him, though they had a chance, attempted to modernise Iraq. This fact, however, can't salvage his image.

#20 Propaganda_of_the_Deed

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Posted 06 March 2012 - 12:33 AM

View PostNoah-, on 05 March 2012 - 08:11 PM, said:

That is not true; he is only interested in elections of those countries who are not 'Saudis' or 'Western' friends. However, Russia is friendly towards the West in the last 12 years, but since it vetoed the resolution against Syria, it gives Mr. Propaganda enough reasons to reject Russian election.

Well as you don't know me well enough to make these judgments, you would know my reasons of dislike for Russian foreign policy extends towards their 200 year occupation and oppression of the Chechen people, and by extension the other Caucasus republics (although the Palestinian cause seems to be the in-thing so that's all what people care about). It's got absolutely nothing to do with the "West", or their veto against intervention in Syria.

Same applies to China, with their mistreatment of Uighurs in occupied East Turkestan and of the Tibetans.

You see, this is precisely why I do not blindly support any one nation-state, because all states at the end of the day act in self-interest.

Sure many on here will cite the Iranian position when it comes to the Palestinian issue, and it's non-relationship with USA and Israel based on "principle", yet self-interest and pragmatism doesn't stop them forming ties with Russia or China, and their ideals and championng of Third Worldism and against oppression of Muslims goes out of the window.

Iran is not the only Muslim country to have ties with Russia and China of course, and of course there are Muslim countries with ties with USA and Israel, it is almost inescapable in this globalized era to have a policy of isolation, however international relations and politics is imperfect, and statesmen and politicians are also imperfect - which is why I do not get too caught up in idealism or nationalism.

I also believe I was the first on this forum to even cite the Thai occupation and oppression of the Pattani Muslims in South Thailand (not that many on here even know about this).

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"If you find yourself alone, riding in the green fields with the sun on your face, do not be troubled.

For you are in Elysium, and you're already dead!"



Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.

~ Charles Patterson

#21 ShiaBen

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Posted 06 March 2012 - 12:39 AM

I have mixed feelings about Stalin. A lot of great things happened under his reign and some bad things.

But to compare him to Hitler, Reagan, or any of these guys, is just flat out, ignorant.

#22 Propaganda_of_the_Deed

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Posted 06 March 2012 - 12:44 AM

Stalin expelled the entire Chechen and Ingush population and placed them in Siberian concentration camps in 1944 after the assumption that they were allying with the Germans against the Red Army btw.

http://kavkazcenter..../23/13628.shtml

http://www.unc.edu/~...ysm/soviet.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/3509933.stm

http://en.wikipedia....he_Soviet_Union

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"If you find yourself alone, riding in the green fields with the sun on your face, do not be troubled.

For you are in Elysium, and you're already dead!"



Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.

~ Charles Patterson

#23 ShiaBen

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Posted 06 March 2012 - 12:46 AM

View PostPropaganda_of_the_Deed, on 06 March 2012 - 12:44 AM, said:

Stalin expelled the entire Chechen and Ingush population and placed them in Siberian concentration camps in 1944 after the assumption that they were allying with the Germans against the Red Army btw.

http://kavkazcenter..../23/13628.shtml

http://www.unc.edu/~...ysm/soviet.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/3509933.stm

http://en.wikipedia....he_Soviet_Union

Which is why he's not perfect.

#24 Propaganda_of_the_Deed

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Posted 06 March 2012 - 12:47 AM

View PostShiaBen, on 06 March 2012 - 12:39 AM, said:

I have mixed feelings about Stalin. A lot of great things happened under his reign and some bad things.

But to compare him to Hitler, Reagan, or any of these guys, is just flat out, ignorant.

More people, including Russians and Ukrainians died under Stalin than under Hitler, and this is well-known. He has comitted some of the worst genocides in the 20th century.

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~ Charles Patterson

#25 Marbles

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Posted 06 March 2012 - 12:47 AM

View PostShiaBen, on 06 March 2012 - 12:39 AM, said:

I have mixed feelings about Stalin. A lot of great things happened under his reign and some bad things.

But to compare him to Hitler, Reagan, or any of these guys, is just flat out, ignorant.

And, of course, comparing Reagan to Stalin isn't "flat out, ignorant", right? :rolleyes:



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