91 replies to this topic

[Muhammed Ali]

I can't say that I believe in Wahdat al-Wujood. I think that the term is incoherent and it doesn't describe the Islamic view. With humbleness, I think that there are significant mistakes in some of the philosophical justifications which are used for some of the popular versions of this theory. However I disagree even more with those who don't even address the philosophical arguments and then falsely accuse other scholars of being pantheists.

If you are going to refute the theory then at lest try to deal with the following: 1, The problem of God being infinite yet separate from the creation. 2, The problem of God creating ex-neo. 3, The matter of whether or not existence is a predicate. 4, The fundamentality of existence etc.

Out of interest here is a reply I got from the office of Sayyid Sadiq Shirazi on this subject:

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Bismillah
Salaam
The notion of wahdat al-wujood is nothing but the antithesis of Islam.
This is because there is no commonality – let alone wahdah – between the existence of creation and that of the Creator.
All the different versions of wahdat al-wujood are in contradiction with the categorical declarations made by the Almighty and the Ahl al-Bayt in this respect; and therefore all versions of the concept of wahdat al-wujood are kufr.
There are, however, some famous "Shi'a scholars" – as you put it – who believe in wahdat al-wujood; but by believing inwahdat al-wujood they are neither Shi’a nor Muslim. Amongst others, the eminent scholar Sayyid Muhammad Kadim Tabatab’ie Yazdi (the author of the authoritative work Orwat al-Wothqaa, the book that the maraje’ comment on and produce their risalah on the basis of) describes, in his Orwat al-Wothqaa, those who believe in wahdat al-wujood as kafirand consequently declares them as najis.
Some of them, in a bid to save their reputation and blend in with the Muslims, or being unawares of the essence of what they are saying, try to justify this false notion by saying there are different versions to it. But in fact the principle notion therein is totally false and rejected by Islam in no uncertain way.
It is enough that there is absolutely no mention of the notion of wahdat al-wujood, in the hadith of Ahl al-Bayt, peace be upon them, given that we have inherited a massive bulk of hadith from Ahl al-Bayt, peace be upon them. If there was any truth and credibility to this concept, we would have had some references to or mention of this notion and the imams would have elaborated upon such a pivotal issue; but – low and behold – nothing of the sort!! If this concept had any truth in it, given its significance, you would have found half of al-Kafi and two-third of Bihar filled with hadith, statements, deliberations and explanations about this matter; but nothing of the sort!! Instead we have hadith after hadith, statement after statement, and explanation after explanation dismissing, refuting, and negating such a notion as that of wahdat al-wujood altogether. The endeavour of those who try to present this notion as Islamic is similar to that of the Christians who try to convince us that the notion of trinity is a Christian concept that was taught by Jesus Christ; this is when we find no shred of evidence in the bible to support of the notion of trinity!!
Allah’s final messenger, the Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him and his pure family, warned of people who would be known as Sufis, who would wear suf (wool) in the summer as part of their discipline to counter their desires, who would come after him who would be deviant from Islam. The twelve divinely-appointed successors or ma'soom Imams proactively rejected this notion and those who adhered to it. At different times and occasions the Imams of Ahl al-Bayt, peace be upon them, went on to explain the principle of tawheed, to establish the standing of Islam on this issue, and refute the deviant claims made by others in this respect, which were surfacing at the time. These hadith and explanations are given in various works ranging from Nahj al-Balaghah [by Imam Ali] and al-Sahifah al-Sajjaadiyyah [by Imam Sajjad] to those such as al-Tawheed by al-Saduq, al-Bihar by al-Majlisi. In addition to numerous specific hadith that we have from our Imams to refute this notion, we also have numerous references to the Islamic tawheed that refute those false notions in most of the dua's or supplications!!  For example look at the Du’a of the Day of Arafah, du’a#47 of al-Sahifah al-Sajjaadiyyah, or – now that we are in the Holy Month of Rajab – study the half-a-dozen or so du’as that are reported for this month – you will find them beautiful and also amazing in addressing the qualities and attributes of the Almighty in respect of tawheed, which at the same time proactively refute and rebuff any aspect of the notion of wahdat-al-wujood!!
Following from the lead of their ma'soom imams and the Ahl al-Bayt, peace be upon them, all true Shi'a scholars have – unanimously and vehemently – rejected this ludicrous notion throughout the ages, and they, citing relevant details, describe this notion as nothing but purely the teachings of Iblis (Satan), who has sworn to deviate mankind from the true path in any way he can.
Of course this notion is not particular to our time – or to the Islamic era – but its roots can be found in old eastern (Indian) religions the idea of which reached old Persia and Greek philosophies, such as plutonic philosophies, during the pre-Islamic era. In their bid to disperse the people from around the Ahl al-Bayt, peace be upon them, the Abbasid rulers systematically commissioned translators to have these philosophies translated from Greek to Arabic and circulated amongst the Muslims. The Abbasids were quite serious about this, and they founded the massive Dar al-Hikmah for this infamous task. [The project of translating those Greek works was first started by the Umayyad's rulers for the said purpose, but the project took second priority when the Umayyad dynasty began to crumble.] Those rulers could not imagine it in their wildest dreams how far-reaching and widespread this belief would become, and flourish even amongst the so-called Shi'a scholars one thousand years later.
The notion of wahdat al-wujood is so absurd that even, for the sake of argument, if we did not have all the hadith from the Ahl al-Bayt, peace be upon them, it would have been enough – to the sound mind – the declaration made by the Almighty in this respect in the Holy Qur’an: {there is nothing like His example} (42:11).
Furthermore, the notion of wahdat al-wujood – to the sound mind – is nothing but a figment of the imagination of the human mind, no matter how elaborate and detailed this imagination may be.
There could be countless thinkers contemplating the essence of the Almighty over countless number of years, but all those careful thoughts and deliberations cannot contain or encompass the essence of the Almighty. Whatever comes to the mind of man about the essence or likeness of the Almighty, we can certainly be assured of one thing – that that is NOT the Almighty.
The knowledge and understanding of the essence of Allah cannot be contained within the mind and understanding of man. Any understanding or possible imagination man can have about the Almighty, then that would NOT be Him and it would NOT be a correct reflection of the Almighty. That is why when the Almighty describes Himself to mankind, He resorts to declaring{there is nothing like His example}.
"The notion of the existence of Allah Almighty is simply beyond the imagination of the human mind", as the hadith and supplications declare. "Anything that the human mind can possibly think of or imagine, He is not that", the hadith stresses.
This is on the aspect of knowledge and understanding of the essence of the Almighty.
On the other hand, on the issue of union or wahdat, there is absolutely no commonality between everything that is created in existence, and the Creator; let alone there being any unity or wahdat between them. This is what the Sufis and the Aarifs claim, including the likes of Mulla Sadra. Please contemplate on this second point without us presenting further discussion......
[In his book “Insan-e Kamel”, p126, Sheikh Murteza Mutahari states: “. . . and some of those who believe in ‘Irfan and wahdat al-wujood, at certain stages, declare that they are God”!!]
Furthermore, contemplate about the hadith and supplication of Imam Jawad (the tenth imam) that addresses the Almighty: "O He who is sufficient (not in need) of everything, while everything in the heavens and earth is in need of Him."
[Perhaps this is not the best translation for this beautiful and short hadith –
يا من يكفي من كل شئ و لا يكفي منه شئ ]
Also contemplate about the Qur'anic verse [I created you while you were not a thing]. (19:9)
And you will realize that in existence we have Allah, the Creator, and we have everything else, the created.
Those who believe in the notion of wahdat al-wujood have gone astray from the teachings of Islam and Ahl al-Bayt, peace be upon them, perhaps due to the training they have been subjected to.  By in believing in this ludicrous notion, the Sufis, Aarifs, and whoever "Shi'a scholars" believe in wahdat al-wujood have abandoned the most basic principle and teaching of Islam, and therefore have become completely deviant from this pure and beautiful religion. For example, in his tafsir al-Mizan, Sayyid Muhammad Hussein Tabataba'ie states something that reveals how deviant they have become. In volume 1, pp28-29 (Beirut edition, 1980) under commentary of surah al-Hamd, he states, "the path to Allah is two paths; the path of the believers, which is the shorter one, and the path of the non-believers, which is the longer."
We shall make no comment on this astonishing statement of his and leave you to contemplate on it.
Was-salaam
NB. This reply has been an extremely short response to your question, and it is not an all-comprehensive refutation ofwahdat al-wujood, but it is just to give an outline and a hint at the invalidity of the notion. A comprehensive refutation ofwahdat al-wujood would be beyond the scope of such a reply.

[Dawud Miqdad al-Amriki]

Yes you quote Nahj al Balagha (which is disputable in many cases and highly misunderstood), but you are not taking the narrations into context.

You are not Allah SWT, nor are you a manifestation of Allah SWT, you can have Rahma from Ar-Rahman, but you are not Ar-Rahman nor a "piece" of Ar-Rahman, you are simply His CREATION.

People who go further than this, as the Imaams have said, are doomed and confused.

I'm blind yet you are trying to understand Allah, who is really blind? You want to attempt to explain Allah and explain how you are a part of Allah when you have no permission to do so, and in fact were warned against it by the Masomeen .

If what you're saying were true then Ibrahim shouldn't have broke the idols, Muhammad (sawa) and 'Ali shouldn't have broke the Idols... Because everything is God, there is no idolatry, there is no division, everything is united, naudhubilah.

If what you're saying is true then Hell-Fire is part of Allah, and Allah is punishing Himself as He is part of it, naudhubilah.  These things are all Allah's CREATIONS.

Wahdat al Wujud is a Sufi doctrine, and the Sufis were cursed

Our master Imam al-Askari (peace be upon him) has also been reported to have said to Abu Hashim al-Ja’fari: “O Abu Hashim! There will come a time where people’s faces are laughing and joyous [while] their hearts are dark and indeterminate. The Sunnah amongst them is innovation and the innovation is Sunnah. The believer amongst them is demeaned and the evil one venerated. Their rulers are oppressive and their scholars through the doors of darkness proceed.

“Their wealthy pillage the provision of their poor. Their young precede their old, and every ignorant to them is an authority, and every assignee to them is poor. They do not differentiate between the sincere and the doubtful, nor do they know the sheep from wolves. Their scholars are the most evil of God’s creation on the face of earth, because they incline towards Philosophy and Sufism. By Allah! They are of the enemies and people of distortion. They exaggerate in their love for our opponents and they misguide our Shi’a and Followers.” (Safinatul Bihar, By al-Muhadith al-Qummi, vol. 2, p. 58).

Wahdat al Wujud wa al Mawjud has no basis in Islam.  The Prophet's and Imaams never taught this from any Qur'an or Hadith, they never said "Wahdut al Wujud", they never spoke of this concept and never taught people to believe it.

[Dhulfikar]

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thecontentedself and Jebreil, just bring me hadith instead of opinions.  Like the following

Brother, Jebreil just show you Quran verses. But if you want hadith, then read Kitab al Tawheed by Sheik Sadoq in Chapter Two and the very fist hadith;

Imam Ali said: ...He cannot be described in terms of when,what and where. He is Hidden amoung the hidden. He is Manifest in the mind through His Signs, and through His Wisdom in His Creation..."

[eThErEaL]

Dawud Miqdad al-Amriki, on 07 February 2012 - 04:45 PM, said:

Yes you quote Nahj al Balagha (which is disputable in many cases and highly misunderstood), but you are not taking the narrations into context.

You are not Allah SWT, nor are you a manifestation of Allah SWT, you can have Rahma from Ar-Rahman, but you are not Ar-Rahman nor a "piece" of Ar-Rahman, you are simply His CREATION.

People who go further than this, as the Imaams have said, are doomed and confused.

I'm blind yet you are trying to understand Allah, who is really blind? You want to attempt to explain Allah and explain how you are a part of Allah when you have no permission to do so, and in fact were warned against it by the Masomeen .

If what you're saying were true then Ibrahim shouldn't have broke the idols, Muhammad (sawa) and 'Ali shouldn't have broke the Idols... Because everything is God, there is no idolatry, there is no division, everything is united, naudhubilah.

If what you're saying is true then Hell-Fire is part of Allah, and Allah is punishing Himself as He is part of it, naudhubilah.  These things are all Allah's CREATIONS.

Wahdat al Wujud is a Sufi doctrine, and the Sufis were cursed

Our master Imam al-Askari (peace be upon him) has also been reported to have said to Abu Hashim al-Ja’fari: “O Abu Hashim! There will come a time where people’s faces are laughing and joyous [while] their hearts are dark and indeterminate. The Sunnah amongst them is innovation and the innovation is Sunnah. The believer amongst them is demeaned and the evil one venerated. Their rulers are oppressive and their scholars through the doors of darkness proceed.

“Their wealthy pillage the provision of their poor. Their young precede their old, and every ignorant to them is an authority, and every assignee to them is poor. They do not differentiate between the sincere and the doubtful, nor do they know the sheep from wolves. Their scholars are the most evil of God’s creation on the face of earth, because they incline towards Philosophy and Sufism. By Allah! They are of the enemies and people of distortion. They exaggerate in their love for our opponents and they misguide our Shi’a and Followers.” (Safinatul Bihar, By al-Muhadith al-Qummi, vol. 2, p. 58).

Wahdat al Wujud wa al Mawjud has no basis in Islam.  The Prophet's and Imaams never taught this from any Qur'an or Hadith, they never said "Wahdut al Wujud", they never spoke of this concept and never taught people to believe it.

You know that no matter what you say those who have actually studied theoretical Irfan and those who have the capacity to understand it will not care about what you are writing.  The only people who will care about what you write are those who haven't studied Irfan and who don't have the capacity to understand anything about it.  So your efforts are pretty much futile.  Just letting you know.

[The Holy Quran]

Salam
Bismillah

Allah is the Creator of Everything. Everything originates from the Originator, which the Creator, the Evolver, and the Distributor of Shapes/Forms/Colors.

Allah is One and Only. "Creation is not "One" in the same sense that God is "One"." Derived from the common sayings of Imam Ali .

There are many things in the universe and all have similarity between them. There are many things, but there is only One Allah.

If looked in the most basic and commonly understandable prospective, then it is obvious to humankind that there is not only one thing that exists, but many things.
Not only Allah exists, but many other things exist that are not classified as Allah. For Example, the Idols in Makkah long ago were not Allah. They may have been created by humans which were created by Allah, but they can never be known as part of the 'Wah-daaniat" or (in simple terms) "Waahidness" or in english "Oneness" of Allah.

I am logically criticizing any form of polytheistic ideology or disbelief. "But still, the disbelievers persist in rejecting." (Quran: 85:19)

Now, to respond to people, Allah is beyond limits for the physical properties of 'existence' which materialistic science cannot prove. Materialistic science which is purely based on physical evidence and does not at all go towards logical inferences or common sense may not be able to prove supernatural forces which do not apply to their point of view.
That is because:
Allah's Exalted Existence cannot be compared to the creation's low-level form of existence. (materialistic science only grasps this low-level form of existence)

Therefore, if they cannot even be compared, then we can conclude that Allah's Exalted Existence is not by any means similar to the creation's existence.
So, because of these reasons, it is logically inappropriate to unify Allah's Exalted Existence with this low-level form of created existence with any reference towards similarity.

Similarity is the main principle in which things can be unified with, so if there is no similarity between the Creator and the creation, then  how will you be able to unify Allah with his creation?

Do not unify Allah with his creation!

Quran supports this: "And there is none that can be comparable to Him." (112:4)

So comparing and then consequently unifying Allah with creation is unacceptable.
This is inapplicable to Allah's Supremely High Exalted Existence.

It will sound more appropriate if you instead of saying "everything exists by God's existence" rather say "Everything exists because Allah created it."

This way it will sound more appropriate and comprehensibly or understandably logical. (Allah has created everything that exists.)

Saying "everything exists by God's existence" is adopted by some, but it will be more easily adaptable if you say it the way I have mentioned above.

Yes, everything would not and could not have existed without Allah's power and mercy, and all strength belongs to Allah, and everything is a manifest sign of Allah.

(But is not and cannot be comparable to Allah)

Wassalam
May Allah Guide Us All To The Right Path

[aldonia]

there is a clear/huge difference between wehdat alwojood and wehdat almawjood..
this sayed needs to learn more! he is absolutely wrong and I can clarify to you if my wording in English help me..

[570]

When a creator created a thing, does that thing have existed from non-existent state? or the creator transformed another thing's shape/form to it?

[Muhammed Ali]

Muhammed Ali, on 07 February 2012 - 04:42 PM, said:

2, The problem of God creating ex-neo.

I meant ex-nihilo.

Dawud, you liked my post. Why?

[Dawud Miqdad al-Amriki]

Muhammed Ali, on 08 February 2012 - 07:33 AM, said:

I meant ex-nihilo.

Dawud, you liked my post. Why?

Because you quoted Sayed Sadiq Shirazi's response to Wahdat al Wujud, and I hadn't read one before.

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It is enough that there is absolutely no mention of the notion of wahdat al-wujood, in the hadith of Ahl al-Bayt, peace be upon them, given that we have inherited a massive bulk of hadith from Ahl al-Bayt, peace be upon them. If there was any truth and credibility to this concept, we would have had some references to or mention of this notion and the imams would have elaborated upon such a pivotal issue; but – low and behold – nothing of the sort!! If this concept had any truth in it, given its significance, you would have found half of al-Kafi and two-third of Bihar filled with hadith, statements, deliberations and explanations about this matter; but nothing of the sort!! Instead we have hadith after hadith, statement after statement, and explanation after explanation dismissing, refuting, and negating such a notion as that of wahdat al-wujood altogether. The endeavour of those who try to present this notion as Islamic is similar to that of the Christians who try to convince us that the notion of trinity is a Christian concept that was taught by Jesus Christ; this is when we find no shred of evidence in the bible to support of the notion of trinity!!

I agree with Sayed Sadiq Shirazi on this issue.  The quotes from Jebreil have nothing to do with the theory of Wahdat al Wujud, it has to do with Allah's Majesty.

"Wherever you turn there is the Face of Allah." 2:115 Qur'an

Firstly, let's define the Face of Allah:

Al-Kafi H 353, Ch. 23, h 1
Muhammad ibn Yahya has narrated from Ahmad ibn Muhammad ibn ‘Isa from Ali ibn al- Ni‘man from Sayf ibn ‘Umayr from those whom he mentioned from al-Harith ibn al-Mughira  al-Nasri who has said the following. "A person asked Imam abu ‘Abdallah (a.s.) about the words of Allah, the Most Holy, the Most High, "Everything will be destroyed except God. . . ." (28:88) The Imam (a.s.) asked, "What do they say about it?" I replied, "They say that everything will perish except the face of Allah." The Imam (a.s.) said, "Glory belongs to Allah. What they say is monstrous. What is meant thereby is that aspect of Allah’s relation with people through which (persons of highest degree of excellence) they establish faith in Him."

Putting that into perspective:

"Wherever you turn there is the Face of Allah." 2:115 Qur'an

"Wherever you turn there is (that aspect of Allah’s relation with people through which (persons of highest degree of excellence) they establish faith in Him.)"

Also, the Imaams have said "We are the Wajhullah (face of Allah, meaning a certain aspect of Allah’s relation with people) that move among you on earth."

This has nothing to do with Wahdat al Wujud.

So instead of trying to create a new Tawheed, just affirm your faith in Allah and stop playing with the imagination which cannot encompass Allah:

"He (Shaytan) only enjoins you evil and indecency, and that you may speak against Allah what you do not know." 2:169 Qur'an

"Say: My Lord has only prohibited indecencies, those of them that are apparent as well as those that are concealed, and sin and rebellion without justice, and that you associate with Allah that for which He has not sent down any authority, and that you say against Allah what you do not know." 7:33 Qur'an

"And follow not that of which you have not the knowledge; surely the hearing and the sight and the heart, all of these, shall be questioned about that." Qur'an 17:36

[Ali_Hussain]

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It is enough that there is absolutely no mention of the notion of wahdat al-wujood, in the hadith of Ahl al-Bayt, peace be upon them, given that we have inherited a massive bulk of hadith from Ahl al-Bayt, peace be upon them. If there was any truth and credibility to this concept, we would have had some references to or mention of this notion and the imams would have elaborated upon such a pivotal issue; but – low and behold – nothing of the sort!! If this concept had any truth in it, given its significance, you would have found half of al-Kafi and two-third of Bihar filled with hadith, statements, deliberations and explanations about this matter; but nothing of the sort!! Instead we have hadith after hadith, statement after statement, and explanation after explanation dismissing, refuting, and negating such a notion as that of wahdat al-wujood altogether. The endeavour of those who try to present this notion as Islamic is similar to that of the Christians who try to convince us that the notion of trinity is a Christian concept that was taught by Jesus Christ; this is when we find no shred of evidence in the bible to support of the notion of trinity!!

replace wahdat al-wujood with wilayat taqweeniyyah, and it would read exactly the same, maybe however wrote this response should make sure all his beliefs are in line with the Qur'an and hadith

[Dawud Miqdad al-Amriki]

Ali_Hussain, on 08 February 2012 - 09:30 AM, said:

replace wahdat al-wujood with wilayat taqweeniyyah, and it would read exactly the same, maybe however wrote this response should make sure all his beliefs are in line with the Qur'an and hadith

The person who wrote that response is Grand Ayatollah Sayed Sadiq Shirazi.

As for Wilayat al-Taqweeni, see the following unambiguous references I offer, then compare this with the lack of references and logic for defending Wahdat al Wujud:

Al-Kafi H 488, Ch. 11, h 3
Ali ibn Musa has narrated from Ahmad ibn Muhammad from al-Husayn ibn Sa‘id and Muhammad ibn Khalid al-Barqi from al-Nadr ibn Suwayd in a marfu‘ manner from Sudayr who has said that he asked Imam abu Ja'far (a.s.) the following. "may Allah take my soul in service for your cause, what are you?" The Imam (a.s.) said, "We are the treasurers of the knowledge of Allah. We are the translators of the revelations of Allah. We possess complete Divine authority over all that is under the heavens and those above the earth."

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10 – ÃÈí – ÑÍãå Çááå – ÞÇá: ÍÏËäÇ ÓÚÏ Èä ÚÈÏÇááå¡ ÞÇá: ÍÏËäÇ ÃÍãÏ Èä ãÍãÏ Èä ÚíÓì¡ Úä ÇáÍÓíä Èä ÓÚíÏ¡ Úä ÝÖÇáÉ Èä ÃíæÈ¡ Úä ÃÈÇä Èä ÚËãÇä¡ Úä ãÍãÏ Èä ãÓáã¡ ÞÇá: ÓãÚÊ ÃÈÇ ÚÈÏÇááå Úáíå ÇáÓáÇã íÞæá: Åä ááå ÚÒæÌá ÎáÞÇ ÎáÞåã ãä äæÑå¡ æÑÍãÉ ãä ÑÍãÊå áÑÍãÊå¡ Ýåã Úíä Çááå ÇáäÇÙÑÉ¡ æÇÐäå ÇáÓÇãÚÉ¡ æáÓÇäå ÇáäÇØÞ Ýí ÎáÞå ÈÇÐäå¡ æÇãäÇÄå Úáì ãÇÃäÒá ãä ÚÐÑ ÃæäÐÑ ÃæÍÌÉ¡ ÝÈåã íãÍæ Çááå ÇáÓíÆÇÊ¡ æÈåã íÏÝÚ ÇáÖíã¡ æÈåã íäÒá ÇáÑÍãÉ¡ æÈåã íÍíí ãíÊÇ æíãíÊ ÍíÇ¡ æÈåã íÈÊáí ÎáÞå¡ æÈåã íÞÖí Ýí ÎáÞå ÞÖíÉ.
ÞáÊ: ÌÚáÊ ÝÏÇß ãä åÄáÇÁ¿ ÞÇá: ÇáÇæÕíÇÁ.

10 – My father – Allah have mercy on Him – said: Sa`d b. `Abdullah narrated to us, he said: Ahmad b. Muhammad b. `Isa narrated to us, from Hasan b. Sa`eed, from Fudalah b. Ayyub, from Abban b. `Uthman, from Muhammad b. Muslim, who said:

i heard Aba `Abdillah (al-Sadiq) [a] say: Indeed Allah, Mighty and Exalted, created certain creatures from His light, and a mercy from His mercy for the sake of His Mercy. For these are the eye of Allah that sees, and His ear that hears, and His tongue that speaks to His creation by His permission, and the safeguards over what has descended from (His) justifications and wanrnings and proofs. And through them He wards off grievances, and through them He sends down mercy, and through them He enlivens the dead, and causes to die the living. And through them He afflicts His creation (with tribulations), and through them He judges cases among His creation.
I asked: May I be your ransom – Who are these?

He [a] replied: Al-Awsiyaa (the vice-regents).

SOURCES:-

1-ma’ani-ul-akhbar, shiekh sudooq, vol 1, chapter 13, hadeeth number10

http://www.tashayyu....hadiths/makhbar

2- al-tauheed, sheikh sudooq, chapter 24, hadeeth 1

http://www.al-shia.o...s/towhid/32.htm

ISNAAD ANALYSIS

the first narrator is father of sheikh sudooq, and his name is ali bin hussein bin musa ibn babwia qummi, and he is thiqa

he took this hadeeth from saad bin abdullah bin abi khalaf al-ashari al-qummi, and he is thiqa

he took it from ahmad bin mohammad bin esa al-ashari, and he is thiqa

he took it from hussein bin saeed bin hamad and he is thiqa

he narrated it from fadala ibn ayub al-azdi, and he is thiqa

he narrated it from aban bin uthman al-ahmar , he is thiqa.

and the last one is mohammad bin muslim bin riyah, and he is thiqa

ISNAAD RESULT

Sahih inshallah.

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ziarat-e-jamia, mentioned by sheikh sudooq

ÈÃÈí ÃäÊã æ Ããí æ äÝÓí æ Ãåáí æ ãÇáí ãä ÃÑÇÏ Çááå ÈÏà Èßã æ ãä æÍÏå ÞÈá Úäßã æ ãä ÞÕÏå ÊæÌå Åáíßã ãæÇáí áÇ ÃÍÕí ËäÇÁßã æ áÇ ÃÈáÛ ãä ÇáãÏÍ ßäåßã æ ãä ÇáæÕÝ ÞÏÑßã æ ÃäÊã äæÑ ÇáÃÎíÇÑ æ åÏÇÉ ÇáÃÈÑÇÑ æ ÍÌÌ ÇáÌÈÇÑ Èßã ÝÊÍ Çááå æ Èßã íÎÊã æ Èßã íäÒá ÇáÛíË æ Èßã íãÓß ÇáÓãÇÁ Ãä ÊÞÚ Úáì ÇáÃÑÖ ÅáÇ ÈÅÐäå æ Èßã íäÝÓ Çáåã æ Èßã íßÔÝ ÇáÖÑ æ ÚäÏßã ãÇ íäÒá Èå ÑÓáå æ åÈØÊ Èå ãáÇÆßÊå

My father, mother, children, possessions and myself are at your disposal; whosoever desires nearness to Allah in fact makes a beginning with you; whosoever professes the Unity of Allah in fact takes after you; whosoever moves towards Him has to turn to you; O my masters! I cannot count and mention your merits; I am unable to come up to the height where your true appreciation can be enjoyed; and your real class can be determined; You are the light of the virtuous; The guides of the pious ones; The claims of the Omnipotent ;Through You Allah opens ; And through You,He seals; Through You He sent down abundant and far-spread rain; Through You the sky  prevents itself from falling down over the earth unless He permits; Through You He drives away troubles and dismisses hardships; With You is that with which His Messengers came down; And with which His Angels descended

References:-

1- man la yahdaral faqih, vol 2, page 615
2- ayoon akhbar-ur-raza, vol 2, page 276

Authenticity
a number of scholars have accepted the authenticity of this ziarat, and amongst them are

• allama baqir majlisi
  
• sheikh ahmad ahsai
  
• syed abdullah shabar
  
• sheikh abbas qummi (compiler of mofateeh ul janan)
  
• hussein shakari
  
• sheikh namazi shahrodi
  
• ayatullah syed adil alawi
  
• syed ali sistani
  
• sheikh nasir makarim shirazi
  
• sheikh yousaf saanei
  
• sheikh ul azam murtaza ansari
  
• syed sadiq rohani
  
• syed sadiq shirazi
  
• syed kazim hairi
  
• sheikh hurr amili
  
• sheikh jawad karbalai
  
• syed yasin al mosvi
  
• allama shaarani
  
• syed baqir ul hakim
  
• syed mohsin amin amili
  
• syed mohammad hussein milani
  
• sheikh mohammad hamood amili
  
• mohammad shahroodi
  
• syed abdul kareem mosvi ardbaili
  
• syed haidar hasni
  
• syed ali hussini sadr
  
• syed jalal mosvi
  
• syed ali barojardi

Quote

amil uz ziarat; page 216;; this ziarat which comes with this sanad

2 Ü ÍÏóøËäí ÃÈí º æÚáíõø Èä ÇáÍÓíä º æãÍãøÏ Èä ÇáÍÓä Ü ÑÍãåã Çááå Ü ÌãíÚÇð ¡ Úä ÓÚÏ Èä ÚÈÏÇááå ¡ Úä ÃÍãÏó Èä ãÍãøÏ Èä ÚíÓì ¡ Úä ÇáÞÇÓã Èä íÍíì ¡ Úä ÇáÍÓä Èä ÑÇÔÏ ¡ Úä ÇáÍÓíä Èä ËõæóíÑ Èä ÃÈí ÝÇÎöÊóÉ «ÞÇá : ßäÊ ÃäÇ æíæäÓ Èä ÙóÈúíÇä æÇáãÝÖøá Èä ÚõãóÑó æÃÈæ ÓóáóãÉó ÇáÓóøÑóøÇÌ ÌõáæÓÇð ÚöäÏ ÃÈí ÚÈÏÇááå Úáíå ÇáÓáÇã
http://www.rafed.net.../kamil/k14.html
we will cover this topic in following headings

• what is the sanad of this narration?
  
• what are the other sources of this narration?
  
• what is being said in this narration?
  
• what is the opinion of marajae about this narration?

SANAD OF THIS NARRATION

so, first we see the rijal


but before we indulge in that, let me tell you that the author of the book, jafar bin mohammad bin jafar bin musa bin qawalia qummi; well known scholar and thiqa; and he had said in the preface in his book that will take narrations from thiqa/trustworthy narrators;
but still we see the rijal
he took this narration from three people

• his father, mohammad bin qawalia, and he is thiqa
  
• ali bin hussein
  
• mohammad bin hasan

the last two have been praised by ibn qawaliyya;
and as we said that he had claimed that he wont take ahadeeth except from thiqa, so it means they are thiqa as per him
these people narrated from
saad bin abdullah bin abi khalaf, he is very famous narrator
and thiqa
[naqd; 2/310-311]
he took it from ahmad bin mohammad bin esa, he is also thiqa and a famous narrator
[naqd; 1/167-168]

next is qasim bin yahya; ghazairi had termed him daif; however, khoi did not agree to this; and considered him thiqa. he even graded chains having qasim as sahih
he, for e.g, writes

æØÑíÞ ÇáÕÏæÞ Åáíå : ÃÈæå ¡ æãÍãÏ Èä ÇáÍÓä ÑÖí Çááå ÚäåãÇ ¡ Úä
ÓÚÏ Èä ÚÈÏÇááå æÇáÍãíÑí ÌãíÚÇ ¡ Úä ÃÍãÏ Èä ãÍãÏ Èä ÚíÓì ¡ æÅÈÑÇåíã Èä
åÇÔã ÌãíÚÇ ¡ Úä ÇáÞÇÓã Èä íÍíì .
æÇáØÑíÞ ßØÑíÞ ÇáÔíÎ Åáíå ÕÍíÍ .

[maujam, 15/68]
so, we see that  al khoi has termed the chain with qasim bin yahya sahih

he also, negates the weakening of ghazairi, and says

ÇáÇæá : Ãäå áÇ íÈÚÏ ÇáÞæá ÈæËÇÞÉ ÇáÞÇÓã Èä íÍíì áÍßã ÇáÕÏæÞ ÈÕÍÉ
ãÇÑæÇå Ýí ÒíÇÑÉ ÇáÍÓíä Úáíå ÇáÓáÇã ¡ Úä ÇáÍÓä Èä ÑÇÔÏ ¡ æÝí ØÑíÞå Åáíå :
ÇáÞÇÓã Èä íÍíì ¡ Èá ÐßÑ Ãä åÐå ÇáÒíÇÑÉ ÃÕÍ ÇáÒíÇÑÇÊ ÚäÏå ÑæÇíÉ . ÇáÝÞíå : Ýí
ÒíÇÑÉ ÞÈÑ ÃÈí ÚÈÏÇááå Úáíå ÇáÓáÇã ¡ ÇáÍÏíË ( 1614 æ 1615 ) ¡ ÍíË Åä Ýí
ÌãáÉ ÇáÑæÇíÇÊ ÇáæÇÑÏÉ Ýí ÇáÒíÇÑÇÊ ãÇ Êßæä ãÚÊÈÑÉ ÓäÏÇ ¡ æãÞÊÖì Íßãå ãØáÞÇ
ÈÃä åÐå ÃÕÍ ÑæÇíÉ íÔãá ßæäåÇ ÃÕÍ ãä ÌåÉ ÇáÓäÏ ÃíÖÇ ¡ æáÇ íÚÇÑÖå ÊÖÚíÝ
ÇÈä ÇáÛÖÇÆÑí áãÇ ÚÑÝÊ ãä ÚÏã ËÈæÊ äÓÈÉ ÇáßÊÇÈ Åáíå .

so, he says that
firstly, the wathaqa of qasim bin yahya is due to grading of sudoq of what he narrated in ziarat of imam hussein, from hasan bin rashid; and in that chain: there is qasim bin yahya, and he talked of it as the most authentic ziarat; in faqih in ziarat of grave of imam hussein, narration 1614 and 1615; and these narrations which come in ziarat are with trustworthy chains; and the order regarding the authenticity of narration demands that it is sahih as per sanad also; so the weakening of ibn ghadairi does not conflict as we we do not have the proof for its nisbat/relation to the writer
plus, tautheeq of ibn qawalia is there for him as well, as khoi has said


Ãä ÇáÞÇÓã Èä íÍíì ËÞÉ áÔåÇÏÉ ÇÈä Þæáæíå ÈæËÇÞÊå æ áÇ íÚÇÑÖåÇ ÊÖÚíÝ ÇÈä ÇáÛÖÇÆÑí áãÇ ÚÑÝÊ ãä ÚÏã ËÈæÊ äÓÈÉ ÇáßÊÇÈ Åáíå.

and for qasim bin yahya, there is testimony of ibn qawaliyya regarding his tautheeq; and so weakening of ibn ghadairi is not conflicting to that for which we have no proof for  it being related to the author

as regards to his father, hasan bin rashid; khoi again considers him thiqa
he mentions the chains of sudooq in his discussion of hasan bin rashid

æØÑíÞ ÇáÕÏæÞ Åáíå : ÃÈæå ÑÖí Çááå Úäå Úä ÓÚÏ Èä ÚÈÏÇááå ¡ æÃÍãÏ
ÇÈä ãÍãÏ Èä ÚíÓì ¡ æÅÈÑÇåíã Èä åÇÔã ¡ ÌãíÚÇ ¡ Úä ÇáÞÇÓã Èä íÍíì ¡ Úä ÌÏå
ÇáÍÓä Èä ÑÇÔÏ .
æÃíÖÇ : ãÍãÏ Èä Úáí ãÇ Ìíáæíå ÑÖí Çááå Úäå Úä Úáí Èä ÅÈÑÇåíã
ÇÈä åÇÔã ¡ Úä ÃÈíå ¡ Úä ÇáÞÇÓã Èä íÍíì ¡ Úä ÌÏå ÇáÍÓä Èä ÑÇÔÏ .
æÝí åÐíä ÇáØÑíÞíä ¡ ßØÑíÞ ÇáÔíÎ Åáíå : ÇáÞÇÓã Èä íÍíì ¡ æåæ ËÞÉ ¡ Úáì
ãÇ íÃÊí .

[maujam, 5/313]

so, this is the chain of sudooq, and khoi had said as we had shown you before, that the chains of sudooq demand that the narrators are accepted as trust worthy, ; also, he had said that qasim ibn yahya is  narrator of kamil uz ziarat, and that is a proof for him being thiqa; the same rule stands true for hasan bin rashid as well

syed mohammad abtahi has also termed him thiqa in tehzeeb-ul-miqaal fi tanqeeh kitab-ur-rijal, vol 2; and he gave two reasons for this

• ibn abi umair has narrated a lot from him
  
• he is narrator of kamil uz ziaraat

and the last one, hussein bin thaweer is thiqa
[naqd; 2/82-83]

OTHER SOURCES OF THIS NARRATION

1- al kafi, vol 4, page 575-577, narration 2-8178
2- man la yahdaral faqih, vol 2, page 594, narration 3199
3- man la yahdaral faqih, urdu version, vol 2, page 369
4- tehzeeb ul ahkam, vol 6, page 54, narration 1
5- bihar ul anwaar, vol 98, page 154

MATAN OF THE NARRATION

here we find that

ãóäú ÃÑÇÏó Çááåó ÈóÏóÁó Èößõãú ¡ [ãóäú ÃÑÇÏó Çááå ÈóÏóÁó Èößõãú ¡

ãóäú ÃÑÇÏó Çááåó ÈóÏóÁó Èößõã] ¡ Èößõãú íõÈóíøäõ Çááåõ ÇáßóÐöÈó ¡ æóÈößõãú íõÈÇÚöÏõ ÇáÒóøãÇäó ÇáúßóáöÈó⁽¹⁾ ¡ æóÈößõãú ÝóÊóÍó Çááåõ æóÈößõãú íóÎúÊöãõ ¡ æóÈößõãú íóãúÍõæ ãóÇ íóÔÇÁõ æóÈößõãú íõËúÈöÊõ ¡ æóÈößõãú íóÝõßõø ÇáÐõáóø ãöäú ÑöÞóÇÈöäÇ ¡ æóÈößõãú íõÏúÑößõ Çááåõ ÊöÑóÉó ßõáöø ãõÄãöäò íõØúáóÈõ⁽²⁾ ¡ æóÈößõãú ÊõäúÈöÊõ ÇáÃóÑúÖõ ÃÔúÌÇÑóåÇ ¡ æóÈößõãú ÊõÎúÑöÌõ ÇáÃÔúÌÇÑõ ÃËúãÇÑóåÇ ¡ æóÈößõãú ÊõäúÒöáõ ÇáÓóøãÇÁõ ÞóØúÑóåÇ æóÑöÒúÞóåÇ ¡ æóÈößõãú íóßúÔöÝõ Çááåõ ÇáúßóÑúÈó ¡ æóÈößõãú íõäóÒöøáõ Çááåõ ÇáÛóíËó ¡ æóÈößõãú ÊõÓöíÎõ ÇáÃÑóÖõ⁽³⁾ ÇáóøÊí ÊõÍúãöáõ ÃÈúÏÇäóßõãú ¡ æóÊóÓúÊóÞöÑõø ÌöÈÇáõåÇ Úóáì ãóÑÇÓöíåÇ ¡ ÅÑÇÏóÉõ ÇáÑóøÈöø Ýí ãóÞÇÏöíÑ ÇõãõæÑöåö ÊóåúÈöØõ Åáóíúßõãú ¡ æóÊóÕúÏõÑõ ãöäú ÈõíõæÊößõãú ¡ æóÇáÕøÇÏöÑõ ÚóãøÇ ÝõÕöáó ãöäú ÃÍúßÇãö ÇáúÚöÈÇÏö

whosoever wishes to get neart to Allah, he has to come to you first; Allah unveils lies through you; and through you the tough and cutting times are removed; and through you Allah started, and through you Allah will end; through you Allah erases what he wants, and through you Allah writes; through you the chains of insult are taken out from our necks; and through you Allah gets the revenge of the death/blood of momins; through you the earth grows trees, and through you trees gets fruit; and through you are revealed rain and food from the skies; and through you  Allah finishes hardships ; through you Allah reveals rain; and through you the earth which is carrying you, praises Allah; and through you its mountains settle their moorings; the will of Allah in the amounts of His affairs land to you, and heads from your houses, and  judgments are issued about the worshipers decisions/deeds,

OPINION OF GRAND MARAJA SYED SADIQ HUSSEIN SHIRAZI ABOUT THIS NARRATION

on my inquiry about this narration and ziarat-e-jamia, His excellency said

Bismillah
Salaam
Yes the statements you quoted in your email are proofs of wilayat-e-takwiniyya of the Ahl al-Bayt peace be upon them all.
Rather these statements point to a status that is even greater than the status associated with the wilayat-e-takwiniyyah in that, as it is mentioned in those statements, Allah Almighty executes His Will through the Ahl al-Bayt peace be upon them.
This notion that Allah Almighty executes His Will though them is something which is higher than the wilayat-e-takwiniyya.
Careful thought needs to be given to this notion. Please think about.
Was-salaam
this fact which He has highligthted is also present in dua-e-nudba, though with different wordings
and there we call imam asws
ÓÈÈ ÇáãÊÕá Èíä ÇáÇÑÖ æ ÇáÓãÇÁ
that is, source of connection between earth and skies
and dua-e-nudba and its contents are termed aqaid-e-haqqa, that is, the true beliefs by allama baqir majlisi in his zaad ul mu’aad
see scans and snapshots here
http://ahlubait.word...uthentic-chain/

http://www.wilayat.n...hadith&Itemid=1

[Haydar Husayn]

Quote

Bismillah
Salaam
The notion of wahdat al-wujood is nothing but the antithesis of Islam.
This is because there is no commonality – let alone wahdah – between the existence of creation and that of the Creator.
All the different versions of wahdat al-wujood are in contradiction with the categorical declarations made by the Almighty and the Ahl al-Bayt in this respect; and therefore all versions of the concept of wahdat al-wujood are kufr.
There are, however, some famous "Shi'a scholars" – as you put it – who believe in wahdat al-wujood; but by believing inwahdat al-wujood they are neither Shi’a nor Muslim. Amongst others, the eminent scholar Sayyid Muhammad Kadim Tabatab’ie Yazdi (the author of the authoritative work Orwat al-Wothqaa, the book that the maraje’ comment on and produce their risalah on the basis of) describes, in his Orwat al-Wothqaa, those who believe in wahdat al-wujood as kafirand consequently declares them as najis.

A 'Grand Ayatullah' (or his office anyway) making outright takfir of a bunch of other 'Grand Ayatullahs'. Nice.

[Dawud Miqdad al-Amriki]

Jebreil, on 08 February 2012 - 12:49 PM, said:

And to Allah belong the east and the west, so wherever you turn yourselves or your faces there is the Face of Allah

"Wherever you turn there is (that aspect of Allah’s relation with people through which (persons of highest degree of excellence) they establish faith in Him.)"

What does this mean? That's a very bad translation. Could you please provide the Arabic instead?


۰۰۰۰۰۰


Clearly you don't believe that creatures lack their own existence whereas God is self-existing and that their existence is by Him - the One. Which would mean One Existence and Many creatures, which you deny.
So, that means, you believe that creatures have their own existence and God has His own existence, and that there are many existences, yes?

If so, you are challenged to 2 questions:

1. What is your narrational proof for believing the above? (you haven't provided any so far)
2. How will you deal with the fact that, if each creature had its own existence, it would not need God for its existence, and so it would be self-existing and eternal?


Again, a reminder, there is no part or aspect of the human being (or any other creature) which is God or a part or aspect of God. Existence and Essence are related, but are not the same at all. They are related just as Creator-creature is related.  

Al-Kafi H 251, Ch. 8, h 10
Ali ibn Ibrahim has narrated from his father from ibn abu ‘Umayr from Muhammad ibn Yahya al-Khath‘ami from 'Abd al-Rahman ibn ‘Utayk al-Qasir who has said the following. "I asked Imam abu Ja‘far (a.s.), about certain attributes of Allah. The Imam raised his hand towards the heavens and said, ‘High is the Almighty. High is the Almighty. One who pursues beyond this, he is doomed.’"

Haydar Husayn, on 08 February 2012 - 12:59 PM, said:

A 'Grand Ayatullah' (or his office anyway) making outright takfir of a bunch of other 'Grand Ayatullahs'. Nice.

Because the Qur'an and narrations are very clear against Shirk and Kufr.

Look at what the proponents of the concept of Wilayat al Faqih say:

Quote

But an order (hukm) issued by the Wali al-Faqih is binding upon all Muslims, not merely his followers, regardless of how far his political authority might reach. Therefore, a command issued by a jurist as Wali al-qada in the administration of justice is obligatory for everyone, even other fuqaha, because the just and capable jurist is appointed as hakim (Wali). This opinion is supported by a tradition from Imam as-Sadiq , in which Umar ibn Hanzala transmits that the Imam prohibited his followers (Shi’a) to recourse to a tyrannical or illegitimate authority (taghut) to resolve their affairs. Instead they are obliged to refer to one who relates the traditions of the Ahlul-Bayt and knows what is lawful and prohibited (i.e. a faqih). Imam as-Sadiq said:
I have appointed him a hakim over you. If such a person orders (judges) according to our ruling and the person concerned does not accept it, then he has shown contempt for the ruling of God and rejects us; and he who rejects us, actually rejects Allah and such a person is close to association [Shirk] with Allah

[Haydar Husayn]

Dawud Miqdad al-Amriki, on 08 February 2012 - 01:31 PM, said:

Because the Qur'an and narrations are very clear against Shirk and Kufr.

You won't find any argument from me. I just think some people pick and choose which beliefs they want to judge by the Quran.

[Dawud Miqdad al-Amriki]

Jebreil, on 08 February 2012 - 01:36 PM, said:

To Dawud


No, I'm afraid that ḥadīth is absolutely irrelevant to your belief that there are many existences, where each creatures has its own existence and God has His own.

I thought you believed in giving proofs from ḥadīth!

Ibn Khaldun (733 - 808 AH.) "The way of the Sufis is the way of the Salaf, the preceding Scholars between the Sahaba and Tabi'een of those who followed good guidance..." [Muqaddimat ibn al-Khaldun, p. 328]

I'm sorry if you've been blinded by Sufism, but the hadith are clear.  Allah is Allah, we affirm Allah through Qur'an and Ahadith, you seek to explain and define and break apart things which you have no permission to do from Allah, may Allah curse the Sufis and deviants.

Their scholars are the most evil of God’s creation on the face of earth, because they incline towards Philosophy and Sufism. By Allah! They are of the enemies and people of distortion. They exaggerate in their love for our opponents and they misguide our Shi’a and Followers.” (Safinatul Bihar, By al-Muhadith al-Qummi, vol. 2, p. 58).

There are numerous ahadith on the Uniqueness of Allah which completely refute this concept of the Sufis.

Al-Kafi H 264, Ch. 10, h 1
Ali ibn Ibrahim has narrated from al-‘Abbass ibn Ma‘ruf from ibn abu Najran from Hammad ibn ‘Uthman from Abd al-Rahim ibn ‘Utayk al-Qusayr who has said the following. "I wrote through ‘Abdal Malik ibn ’a‘yan to Imam abu ‘Abdallah (a.s.). "In Iraq there are people who attribute to Allah forms and lines. If you consider it proper, may Allah take my soul in your service, please write for me the correct belief in the issue of the Oneness of Allah."

The Imam wrote for me, "May Allah grant you blessings. You have asked about the Oneness of Allah and the belief of the group before you. Exalted is Allah, to Who nothing is similar. He is All-hearing and All-seeing. Allah is above what certain people attribute to Him and analogize Him with His creatures and the lies of those who speak lies about Him. Note that the true doctrine in the Oneness of Allah is what is revealed in the Quran in about the attributes of Allah, the Almighty, the Exalted. Keep away from the belief in Allah, the Most High, all ideas that amount to ignoring His existence altogether and those that amount to analogizing Him with the creatures. Neither should His existence be negated nor should He be considered similar to anything. He, Allah, the Most High exists. Exalted is He and far above what is falsely attributed to Him. Do not exceed the limits of the Quran lest you go astray after the clear presentation of Truth."

I've narrated many ahadith to you, but you appear to be blindly rejecting them; their evidence is overwhelming.

@ Haydar Husayn; maybe you're right, but we all must pick and choose what we think is right, otherwise what is the criteria for right and wrong if not our 'Aql? Do we accept everything which is SaHeeH? But there are many Sunni SaHeeH narrations, do we accept every Tafseer? But there are different Tafseer.  So the point is that some things are clear, others less clear, for what is clear we either love or hate, we love the good and hate the evil, when someone does clear kufr we hate the kufr and we do tabarra`.  That is what Grand Ayatollah Sayed Sadiq Shirazi is doing, Tabarra` of the Sufis because of the overwhelming evidence against them, even specifically by name in the riwayah I've mentioned above.

Wahdat al Wujud was a concept invented by the Sufis, it has no basis in Islam whatsoever.

Quote

Taken from Wikipedia:

Ibn Arabi is most often characterized in Islamic texts as the originator of the doctrine of wahdat al-wujud, however, this expression is not found in his works and the first who employed this term was perhaps, in fact, the Andalusian mystical thinker Ibn Sabin.*

Islamic Philosophy from Its Origin to the Present: Philosophy in the Land of Prophecy, State University of New York Press, p. 156

*Abu Mohammed Abd el-Hakh Ibn Sabin was a Sufi philosopher, the last philosopher of the Andalous in the west land of Islamic world. He was born in 1217 in Spain and lived in Ceuta. He was known for his replies to questions sent to him by Frederick II, ruler of Sicily. He died in 1269 in Mecca. He was also known for his knowledge of religions (Judaism, Christianity but even Hinduism and Zoroastrism) and the "hidden sciences."

So if this reference is correct, then the term "Wahdat al Wujud" was not used until 1217 (near 600 years after hijra).

The concept may be studied in Ibn Arabi's works, as is widely frequented by Khomeini and other mystics... But Ibn Arabi was a Sunni Sufi who rejected the school of Ahlul-Bayt , sure let's take our concept of Tawheed from a Nasibi or a Zalimun.

[Maitham]

Salam alaykom

Dawud have you described Allah's abolutness now ?

do you believe that Allah has separate parts so that his being the "Living" is separate form his being "the Powerful"? clearly all things have life that is existence what you are seeing is only shape and form and colors (in another word quditie). existence is what makes all those things "be" . we cannot say they do not exist or they would not be here, so if all things are existing what is different between the existence of the rock and the person, the earth and the sun ? (remember not it's quditie - shape, form, or color) now if you ponder on this you will realize you really cannot say it is different can you? what we say is that that existence comes from God just as strength does. Allah being the absolute and single the one who has no similar all these things belong to him entirely. this is what i understand unity of being to be, so therefore it cannot be claimed that Allah  is limited, nor can it be claimed that he is in one place and not the other nor can the weak created beings who own nothing could every say they are the absolute reality. thus their creation is clear and their dependence on Allah is clear in a higher way than most people would consider as even our being here is depending on Allah. this is why if Allah was not here not even ash would exist.


in Tuhaf al Uqoul that says

Abaya inquired imam Ali about the ability by which we can stand erect, sit, and do things.

The imam answered “You inquired about the ability. Do you poss it with or without Allah?”
Abaya could not find any answer
The imam then said “If you claim you possess it without Allah, I will kill you. And If you claim you possess it with Allah, I will kill you too”
He said “what should I say, then?”
The imam replied “You possess it by way of Allah who possess it exclusively. If he gives you part of it then he is bestowing upon you, and if he seizes it from you, that will be a kind of his test. He is the possessor of the ability that he gives to you and he is the prevailing on the matters that you can do”

Do you notice how imam is noteing the punnishment that i guess must be for an apostate^ so your beliving your Life is without or with Allah can be extracted from this above statment. therefore if we hold Allah has no seprate parts and power and life all belong to him we would maintain an idea of oneness and no partners.and also the abolutness of these meanings (of power, and life) cannot be comprehended by limited minds. Tawheed as shown by Ahlul bayt is a deep ocean. one must try to ponder on them enough to find the proper places for each explanation sent to us.

Edited by Maitham, 08 February 2012 - 03:04 PM.

[Dawud Miqdad al-Amriki]

Insha'Allah you can read this article.

Al-Kafi H 308, Ch. 15, h 4
Muhammad ibn abu ‘Abdallah has narrated from Muhammad ibn Isma‘il from some of his
people from Bakr ibn Salih from Ali ibn Salih from al-Hassan ibn Muhammad ibn Khalid ibn
Yazid from ‘Abd al-A‘la from abu ‘Abdallah (a.s.), who has said the following.
"The name of Allah is something other than Allah Himself. Every thing that is called a thing
is created except Allah. Whatever is expressed by the tongue or is worked out by hands are all
created. The word Allah is one example of names and an end for naming. The end is different
from the thing for which it is. The end is describable is created. The Maker of things is not
describable by the limits of the fact behind the name. He did not become, so His becoming a
being would have been recognized through the making of what is other than Him. He did not
end up where there was another’s end. Do not ever move away from understanding this rule.
This is the true and pure believe in the Oneness of Allah. Observe it, acknowledge it and
understand it by the permission of Allah.
Those who think they understand Allah by means of covering, form or examples they become
polytheists because his covering, form and example are not Him. He is only One and One
alone. How can one form a belief in His Oneness by thinking that one may know Him
through things other than Him. One comes to know Allah only by Allah His Own self. One
who can not know Him by His Own self he has not known Him. He only comes to know
some thing else. There is nothing between the Creator and the created. All is the Creator of
things but not from a thing that was there already. Allah’s names are His names but He is
different from His Own names and the names are other than Him."

As I quoted in one of my earlier posts, Wahdut al Wujud is from Ibn Arabi's mind, which produced the likes of the following (see blow).  When one believes that Allah is all there is, everything is Allah, indivisibly so, when one has sex with one's wife, you are actually deriving pleasure from Allah, it is in fact the case that both you and your wife are One just as Allah is One, and You are Jealous as Allah is Jealous of His Creation thinking He obtained pleasure in sex from His Wife and not from Allah.  Naudhubilah wa astagfirullah.  If this doesn't shake you out of this filthy concept then I don't know what will akhi, la howla wa la quwatta ila bila.

Quote

When a man loves a woman, he desires union, that is, the goal of union which exists in love. In the elemental form, there is no greater union than marriage. (10) By this appetite encompasses all parts. For that reason, complete ritual washing is prescribed after intercourse. Purification envelops him as annihilation in the woman was complete in the obtainment of appetite. Allah is very jealous of His slave if He believes that he finds pleasure in other than Him. So man purifies himself by ritual washing in order to return to Him in whom he was annihilated, since that is all there is.

When man witnesses Allah in women, his witnessing is in the passive; when he witnesses Him in himself, regarding the appearance of woman from Him, he witnesses Him in the active. When he witnesses Him from himself without the presence of any form from him, his witnessing is in the passive directly from Allah without any intermediary. So his witnessing of Allah in the woman is the most complete and perfect because he witnesses Allah inasmuch as He is both active and passive. Regarding himself, He is passive in particular. For this reason, the Prophet, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, loved women because of the perfection of the witnessing of Allah in them since one does not ever witness Allah free of matter. Allah by His essence in independent of the worlds. So from this aspect, the business is impossible, yet witnessing only occurs in matter. The witnessing of Allah in women is the greatest and most perfect witnessing. The greatest union is marriage.

Page 128 of Fusus al-Hikam by ibn Arabi, chapter 27 "The Seal of the Unique Wisdom in the Word of Muhammad"

There you have it, everything is Allah, including your sex life.

Still want to defend this filth? Tawbah and Tabarra insha'Allah.

[BillyJo]

[The Holy Quran]

Salam
Bismillah

"These are verses of the Wise Book. A Guide and Mercy to the Doers of Good. Those who do regular prayer, charity, and have assurance of the Hereafter.    
    - Quran Surah Luqman Ayahs 2-4 (31:2-4)

If I am stating any Quranic verse then it is for the people mentioned in the Holy Verse above.
(Shiite)

All us here are Shia Brothers in Islam, and love to mention Dhikr or Remembrance of Allah's Words, the Holy Quran.
Whether it be verse about Heaven or Hell, all is as a mercy. So keep peace.

"So celebrate with Praises the name of Thy Lord, the Supreme!"   (56:96)

Now, back to topic.

Instead of "all power is Allah" we can again process it into a better figurative wording: "All power is from Allah."

Many will find difference in "all power is Allah" and "all power is from Allah". It is quite obvious that 'from' and 'is' are both different.

If I say that anyone threw an arrow, then that surely means that the power to throw the arrow comes from Allah. Agree?

If you agree, then notice that I used the term 'comes from'.

"There is no power except in God" should rather be "There is no power except the power that is bestowed by Allah." This way it will sound much much better.

Just clarifying, all power comes 'from' Allah and there is no power except 'from' Allah. (or there is no power except that it is given by Allah)

"Wherever you turn there is the Face of Allah." Surah Al-Baqarah Verse 115.
Well, Allah didn't say 'wherever you turn there is Allah'. He said 'Face' of Allah, or 'Wajhullah'. Allah does not have physical face so whatever 'face' means it can't be physical.
(materialistic science classifies 'existence' as 'physical' so if looked in that point of view then you say that Allah's face does not exist.)

All around us we see things that are physical, including our own bodies. Allah does not have a physical face. So according to the previous sentence everything that physically exists cannot be the face of Allah.

So therefore, we make the conclusion that 'Face' does not mean that it is physically the physical existence of everything, but rather has a different meaning.
('Face' may be translated as the object of reflection by which you automatically be directed/reflected back towards Allah.)

Now, again, the Du'aa Kumayl says: "And by the light of your Face which has lighten all things."

He did not say: "And by the light of your Face which is all things." You won't find this hilariously theoretical statement in any verse of the Quran. The same logical inference can be made here that was made with the previous verse mentioned. 'Face' probably means something else. (not physical or material)

May Allah Help Us In Understanding True Religion
May Allah Help Us In Understanding The Holy Quran
May Allah Guide Us All To The Right Path

Wassalam
With Peace