Ugly Jinn, on 02 November 2011 - 02:00 AM, said:
I never stated He 'needs', I'm implying if He is bound by His attributes then He has a dependency.
right but when one is dependent they are in need of what they are dependent on. But I am fine with even using dependency.
I don't see the need to compartmentalize God into 'essence'/'divinity'/etc. The question is simple regarding 'why did God created us', and it seems we are trying to justify creation. My fundamental point is that any justification for God creating us will inject a 'necessity/dependency' into the formula. God can still remain a God without a vassal.
We do need to draw a conceptual distinction between the Divinity and the Essence when dealing with such issues. Because the distinction is simply about a God that we can talk about or understand (Divinity), and a God that we cannot talk about or understand (Essence). But if you don't have a (necessity/dependency) you are left with its opposite, namely that god created the creation in a way that it was completely accidental to Himself. Which necessarily implies that He created the creation arbitrarily. Because whatever the reason for creating the creation is, that reason must be found within Himself and not outside Himself. Because nothing outside Himself can influence Him.
Now this whole idea of Lord-vassal (please note spelling error in my previous post) and how the two co-imply each other is a standard way of envisaging God in the Islamic tradition. An interesting and beautiful hadith comes to mind that goes like this: <em> "had the people not sinned, God would have destroyed them and replaced them with a people who do sin just so that He can forgive them.
My main point is that answering the question "Why God created us?" with logic and reasoning is void. Why you must ask? Because God is not bound to logic and reasoning, He doesn't need to act based on 'logic or reasoning', hence our attempt is illogical to use 'logic and reasoning' to understand the decision by God to create.
But logically there can only be two options. Either the reason for creating lies outside of God in which case this would be shirk since something other than God influenced God. Or the reason lies within God Himself in which case it would not be shirk. If it lies within Himself it is essential to Himself and not accidental. This is the point and a very important one.
Only God can answer why He created. Unfortunately, from an Islamic point of view He didn't state clearly why in the Quran (there are couple of Hadith but they aren't applicable).
Brother. Our entire existence is about this particular question. Inasmuch as one can truly answer this question with his heart and not only with his tongue then one has fulfilled his purpose as a human being. what makes human beings more perfect than other is the extent to which they understand the answer to this question. The answer to this question constitutes our very identity as a human being.
Edited by eThErEaL, 02 November 2011 - 03:06 AM.