384 replies to this topic

[MysticKnight]

No no she has every right to know if she is so paranoid about this issue.

What if she didn't think about the issue? She doesn't have the right to know.?What if she isn't suspecting it at all? By the way, what is your proof that she has the right to know if she is paranoid? I hope not your own ethics but proof from Quran and hadiths, which is your only source of morality.

Obviously they can do a blood test and if the new wife is healthy or is a virgin then this issue is non existent and if the new wife is a risk then she has the right to refuse the marriage because that directly impacts her health

Is it required they do a blood test and that the husband informs the wife? Proof from Quran and hadiths, don't bring your own ethics.

The fact is the law, Quran and Sunnah, says nothing about informing the wife of muta, so where do you get he must inform her? Now you are making blood tests obligatory, where did you get that from, what's the proof from Quran and Sunnah?

Edited by MysticKnight, 30 August 2011 - 07:00 PM.

[heba1010]

I hope everything works out for you and that she is an easy woman to deal with.

Insha Allah I will gain a sister and a friend for life.

[Awaiting_for_the12th]

Insha Allah I will gain a sister and a friend for life.

is there anyway we can clone your dna and add it to all shia women in world? lol

[alimohamad40]

Salaam
Mystic the evidence from Quran and sunnah is present.
Fish formulas that say
God can not be obeyed via disobeying him
áÇ íØÇÚ Çááå ãä ÍíË íÚÕí
And another rule that avoiding harm takes precedence
áÇ ÖÑÑ æ áÇ ÖÑÇÑ

[14infallibles]

Salaam
Mystic the evidence from Quran and sunnah is present.
Fish formulas that say
God can not be obeyed via disobeying him
لا يطاع الله من حيث يعصي
And another rule that avoiding harm takes precedence
لا ضرر و لا ضرار

Brother can you please elaborate
Thank you very much wassalam alaykom

[MysticKnight]

It's funny how for years this principle never occured to him and he been telling people how a husband can do as much muta as he wants without telling wife or giving tests.

I wonder if by this principle, it's required all Muslims go through tests before any relationship? I will see how he proves this.

[Ya Aba 3abdillah]

I wonder if by this principle, it's required all Muslims go through tests before any relationship? I will see how he proves this.

It's common practice in Lebanon to have blood tests before marriage.

A taboo topic at the moment in the Gulf is men bringing home with them HIV after sleeping with russian prostitutes http://www.nytimes.c...st/08saudi.html when they go to the west to blow their money.

And in Bahrain
http://ipsnews.net/n...sp?idnews=49498

Umbassil contracted the virus a few months ago from her previous fiancée who initiated unprotected sex. The two were married according to Muta'a or the temporary marriage custom prevalent in many Arab countries, which does not have legal sanction but is socially accepted.

She discovered her HIV status only after she underwent an HIV/AIDS test, which is a compulsory procedure for the government to acknowledge a marriage.

[Master Chief]

It's common practice in Lebanon to have blood tests before marriage.

A taboo topic at the moment in the Gulf is men bringing home with them HIV after sleeping with russian prostitutes http://www.nytimes.c...st/08saudi.html when they go to the west to blow their money.

And in Bahrain
http://ipsnews.net/n...sp?idnews=49498

Yup, Tests are usually done before marriages in Bahrain (I saw patients coming to get tested). Though there is a lot of health related ignorance widespread over there.

[alimohamad40]

Bro 14
The first law I stated says that you can not disobey god inorder to obay him
The intention of marriage in the ideal situation is to obey god but when you conceal from ur wife the fact that your bringing a disease to her stripping her away from the choice to accept or reject to receive this disease then your harming her and hence it's a disobedience to god.
So you can not in order to obay god you go and disobey him.
The second rule is that preventing harm takes precedence over other mustahab acts and transmitting a disease to another human is a direct harm.

Bro or Sis mystic
I have said million times that it's wajib kefaie (sufficiency obligation) and not wajib ainy
This means if others do it instead of you it suffices and I gave the example of washing the dead body

The whole idea is to set a model to normalize this sanctioned institution and or participate in it from the responsibility point of view
Why do u say I've been telling men to practice polygyny with a total disregard for the harms that it could cause?
Offcourse you can not classify the self imposed harm that jealous females inflict on themselves to be legitimate harm or else we also have to legitimize the rejection of hijab by many secular minded people because it does hurt them also if we observe hijab no?
And if this disease thing is that serious and high risk then all people would have stopped marriage altogether because huge percentages of marriages happen between people who have already been married before .

[ImAli]

It's common practice in Lebanon to have blood tests before marriage.

A taboo topic at the moment in the Gulf is men bringing home with them HIV after sleeping with russian prostitutes http://www.nytimes.c...st/08saudi.html when they go to the west to blow their money.

And in Bahrain
http://ipsnews.net/n...sp?idnews=49498

Yeah you do have to get blood tests in Lebanon before you get married, I remember the idiot who couldn't find my vein and kept poking holes in me . As for the topic of the gulf, some people having a conversation about that like 10 years ago it is nothing new. The part that eats me up is not the men who do this before they are married (let them take it up with God), but the men who are married and get AIDS from the prostitute then passes it to his wife or wives.

Edited by ImAli, 31 August 2011 - 08:31 AM.

[Ruq]

Salaam eid Mubarak

Ruqayah:
It's not the right of the wife to know if her husband took another wife because it's not her business specially if she wants to know in order to reject or harm the others or destroy the new flourishing relationship.
It's only her right not to be lied to and there is a big difference between not announcing and actually lying

What an incredibly facile and short sighted thing to say. That would require leading a double life where lying in order to keep the secret would be unavoidable and the effect wouldnt be any different than being directly lyed to. if youre in a business situation and your partner in business is keeping an integral peice of information about what he's doing with part of this business away from you, using what you share for his seperate personal agains that could risk the health and success of that business and you find out, you'd feel lied to and in essence you have been lied to. It would be hard to trust him after such deceit and he has put your business relationship in peril because of his selfish actions. Does your business partners desire to make money on the side using your jointly owned capital justify his risk taking with it?
Now replace the business with a person you pledged to dedicate yourself to and protect and a number of kids. What it boils down to is that this individual is playing with peoples lives in order to have a bit of extra nooky. The deception is not and can never be justified.

[ImAli]

What an incredibly facile and short sighted thing to say. That would require leading a double life where lying in order to keep the secret would be unavoidable and the effect wouldnt be any different than being directly lyed to. if youre in a business situation and your partner in business is keeping an integral peice of information about what he's doing with part of this business away from you, using what you share for his seperate personal agains that could risk the health and success of that business and you find out, you'd feel lied to and in essence you have been lied to. It would be hard to trust him after such deceit and he has put your business relationship in peril because of his selfish actions. Does your business partners desire to make money on the side using your jointly owned capital justify his risk taking with it?
Now replace the business with a person you pledged to dedicate yourself to and protect and a number of kids. What it boils down to is that this individual is playing with peoples lives in order to have a bit of extra nooky. The deception is not and can never be justified.

Lying by omission

[alimohamad40]

Lying by omission

Lying by omission is only when some one ommits an information which they are obliged to provide you. The fact that am not telling you what I had for lunch last night does it make me an omitting liar?
Because you falsely assume that it's the first wife's business and her permission is required that's why you regard it her right to know

Edited by alimohamad40, 03 September 2011 - 09:06 AM.

[ImAli]

Lying by omission is only when some one ommits an information which they are obliged to provide you. The fact that am not telling you what I had for lunch last night does it make me an omitting liar?
Because you falsely assume that it's the first wife's business and her permission is required that's why you regard it her right to know

It is her right to know, anytime you sleep with another person you put your wife's health at risk.

[Haydar Husayn]

It is her right to know, anytime you sleep with another person you put your wife's health at risk.

Just to be clear, is this the only basis on which you think a wife has a right to know?

[alimohamad40]

It is her right to know, anytime you sleep with another person you put your wife's health at risk.

if you are putting her health at risk then yes she has to know and i never dispute that because thats a basic human right

but who says every time the husband marries he is creating a health problem?

and be truthful to yourself the main reason you reject is not this because a man could acquire the same or bigger risk from serial monogamy and I don't think you oppose that one marries and already married before

[ImAli]

if you are putting her health at risk then yes she has to know and i never dispute that because thats a basic human right

but who says every time the husband marries he is creating a health problem?

and be truthful to yourself the main reason you reject is not this because a man could acquire the same or bigger risk from serial monogamy and I don't think you oppose that one marries and already married before

This is a huge reason why I object to it being kept secret and I don't understand your question about one marries and already married before. Are you speaking of divorce? No I could care less if people divorce or if they marry again or if they marry 20 people. As for myself....I don't really care to be in a polygamous relationship, just a personal choice and your personal choice is you believe you need to be in a polygamous relationship.....that is your choice.

[Ruq]

Im in the UK and a doctor advised me to ask any potential partner to be tested for chlamydia before intimacy took place. Its sad that things have gotten to that stage, but thats one of the many negative consequences of 'putting it about'. It seems to me the more a person can control themselves in that area the better of all society would be. I think monogomy is the ideal even in Islam, the prophet(saw) and Imam Ali(as) were monogomous for a significant period of time and we're all taught not to put of marriages for the simple reason of poverty, that 'God will provide', so i dont believe poverty was the primary reason for that, i think the reason was because they were love marriages, as opposed to social/political marriages. I think a love marriage has different dynamics to other kinds of marriages. I think in a polygamous marriage it is healthier not to be in love with your partner.

[Qasimi]

it is halal it says in the quran in surah nisa verse 3 i think. but he has to treat you equally in all aspects. if he cant then he shouldnt take another wife (permanently)

[heba1010]

Who knows a good book I can read on plogny so that I can be correct in my conduct and not upset my husband with wrong questions and make his time with me a heartship. It seem now are time is fulled with hurt and pain when it was loving and fun just months before. I am trying my very best to be a good wife I just need to understand. I wondering do I just go along with my husband as if she is not in the picture. Like when I was unaware of her beign with my husband. I have been told by many sister and bro in the deen that I have been more understanding them most would ever be. Now he want to move her and her 3 kids into our old house to live untill we can all relocate to a different city they have yet to get married ?? I m not sure what the hold up is about them getting married. I am aware of her so go on with it ??? someone help me understand that.

im not sure what to do at this point with all my emontions and all my pain I feel so along without anyone to understand my side of things. it their a chat group for woman in my same place??? if so can someone direct me to it.

[Haydar Husayn]

If your husband hasn't married this woman, either permantly or temporarily, then he is committing a grave sin, and you don't have to put up with what he is doing. You also don't have to share a house with another woman if you don't want to. If he isn't capable of providing seperate living accomodation for another wife, then he should stick to having one wife. Just because polygamy is allowed, it doesn't mean your husband can do whatever he wants. I think you need to read up on your rights and his responsibilities, because it sounds to me like he is taking serious liberties. Polygamy is halal, but it needs to be within the bounds of sharia.

[Gypsy]

It is her right to know, anytime you sleep with another person you put your wife's health at risk.

If someone is a virgin then they do not have to worry about STD.

Either you tell your spouse about all your sex partners or go through the medical test. You cant always assume that people who are promiscuous (regardless of through halal or haram relationship) knows about safe sex.

[alimohamad40]

If someone is a virgin then they do not have to worry about STD.

Either you tell your spouse about all your sex partners or go through the medical test. You cant always assume that people who are promiscuous (regardless of through halal or haram relationship) knows about safe sex.

If someone is a virgin then they do not have to worry about STD.

Either you tell your spouse about all your sex partners or go through the medical test. You cant always assume that people who are promiscuous (regardless of through halal or haram relationship) knows about safe sex.

Salaam
This is the funniest promiscuous through halaal. That's like saying legitimate theft. But I think we know what you are trying to say.

Edited by alimohamad40, 15 September 2011 - 08:39 PM.

[asma0401]

it can't be mutah if he is near his wife. mutah is only allowed during jihad or if the husband is away from the wife on business for more than six months.

[Haydar Husayn]

it can't be mutah if he is near his wife. mutah is only allowed during jihad or if the husband is away from the wife on business for more than six months.

Who told you this? Because it is absolutely false.