472 replies to this topic

[Dar'ul_Islam]

اللهم قنا من الشرك والغلو والتقصير والبدع ولاتخلّط فينا أهلها بحق محمد وآل محمد صلى الله عليهم أجمعن والعن اعداءهم كثرا ابدا
O Allah, protect us (save us) from Shirk, ghuluw, taqseer, and innovations and do not mix among us its people, by the right of Muhammad wa Ali Muhammad (s) and la`n upon their enemies many times over and forever.

في امان الله

[Hannibal]

muslimunity1, on 27 June 2012 - 01:11 PM, said:

Aslamalaykum,

@Brother Hannibal

Message from Wasil.....

assalam alaykom

jazakallah khairan akhi hannibal and may Allah guide us all. the debate was not the reason i reverted at all. I defended sheikh ibrahim in a way that no other person did as far as i know. And also showed shortcomings of abu hurairah(ra) in hadith which i regret now because after all the man helped preserve the sunnah of the prophet greatly and i am nothing compared to him to even criticize him, and the debate seemed to me like the kind of "jadal" Allah hates.



the reason i reverted is that i found myself having very paradoxical feelings inside me and big doubt about many issues. with my illness which is not just psychological but i don't want to talk about it , i realized how weak i am and i wanted to meet Allah with the belief that is simple. i still believe in twelve imams from ali till mahdi but i also believe sahabah did good even if they did mistakes then who are we to judge them. as i said we took the love of abu bakr and omar and ayesha and othman ridhwan allahi alaihim from our mothers milks (arabic expression) and i want to meet Allah without hatred or grudge against anyone especially people i grew up loving them ridhwan allahi alaihim.

in my illness as i told brother farid im sometimes a shia for an hour then a sunni for an hour and sometimes i am neither this or that .... brother when faced with severe trauma (may Allah protect you) a man realizes how weak he is and how needy for Allah's mercy he is.

i finish with the saying of imam juwaini on his deathbed and he was he was in knowledge etc , he said \: today i die upon the belief of old women of naisaboor.

ws

Salam,

I understand your concern. I think part of the problem with religiosity in general (whether you are Christian, Muslim etc.) is that more often than not, the gray spots are ignored and people are more comfortable with sitting in the black and white. When their absolutist positions are challenged, they often react very negatively to them. If there is something that history has taught me is that things are seldom black and white. For one, although I do have some serious problems with some of the companions, I am not of the opinion that they never did any good in their lives (I think a number of them did good, both intentionally and/or unintentionally). I think it is rare to find a human being to be of such pure evil where he has done nothing positive in his or her life. However, I also don't agree with the position that the companions were infallible on the practical level (i.e. theoretically they are not infallible, but in practice they are because every short-coming will be justified) as they did some really horrible things as well (which I don't believe we should just forget and leave it to the DJ only because these actions are still relevant till this day). This absolutist position on practical infallibility has been the position of the proto-Sunnis since the 700s C.E.

Given that Shi'ism and Sunnism developed in tense political and religious climates, it's not surprising that both of them historically ended up adhering to very rigid doctrinal positions (position of the Imams, Companions, created nature of the Qur'an etc.) that more often than not, didn't make historical sense. I suspect that (I could be wrong) that you, like most people (which I myself am included in), might have gotten stuck in these doctrinal walls and you may have realized that the Truth is not that simple and is perhaps somewhere nearer the gray area. The unfortunate part of the gray area is that one needs to accept the reality of doubt  and know that certainty is not something that is found in polemics or books, but it is a Light that Allah puts into the heart of a believer (many Muslims can't accept doubt because of modern influences, so they'll come up with nonsense silly things like science in the Qur'an or miracle numbers in order to find a false sense of certainty).

Inshallah I'll pray the best for you and that you can find that tranquility and insha'Allah you can do the same for me!

Edited by Hannibal, 27 June 2012 - 02:55 PM.

[Hannibal]

By the way, if Wasil has an auto-immune disease (like Crohn's, UC etc.) which is usually associated with psychological stress, I can help with remedies as I have some good experience in that area (doctors are useless when it comes to AI diseases).

[Aabiss_Shakari]

A normal person boards only a single ship and never boards on two. How can i love Allah and Shaitan at the same time? This is the problem with Wasil now that he wants to board two ships at the same time.

[zulfeeqar]

Aabiss_Shakari, on 28 June 2012 - 09:30 AM, said:

A normal person boards only a single ship and never boards on two. How can i love Allah and Shaitan at the same time? This is the problem with Wasil now that he wants to board two ships at the same time.

Key is to acknowledge the existence of grey area what hannibal rightly pointed out.

Truth surely lies some where in the grey area.

Edited by zulfeeqar, 09 July 2012 - 03:36 PM.

[Sayyed Ali]

These are possibly the last words of Walid:

Quote

alam alaykom

this might be my last post in this life

I just bought a gun with its bullets , i know brothers it's haram but i can't go on like this . i became a shadow of a man used to be and even my wife looks down on me now. i can't blame her she is fed up with my illness and [Edited Out] . I am planning to do it tonight inshallah. i can't stop crying and i'm trembling and i am scared , yes scared of death but this seems to be the least evil option. i am finished

salam alaykom warahmatollah

i will die upon la ilaha illa Allah mohamed rasool Allah and as zurarah said on his deathbed : the quran is my imam

salam alaykom
salam alaykom

salam alaykom efendi

salam ali muawya

salam farid and hani and everyone , you were my enemies but you were kinder to me than my own family

salam alakom

If there is someone here who knows him personally, should go to him and help him before he kills himself.

[Al-MuHammadee]

If he does that, he will end up in Hellfire. If he stays alive, he still has a chance of stopping his rebellion against his Imaam and get saved by the latter.

[Ali_Hussain]

Wasn't someone talking about writing a shiachat book the other day, or making a film?

[Gypsy]

This is terrible.

Does anyone know how to get in touch with him. Did anyone speak to him.

[Logic]

Hannibal, on 28 June 2012 - 03:13 AM, said:

By the way, if Wasil has an auto-immune disease (like Crohn's, UC etc.) which is usually associated with psychological stress, I can help with remedies as I have some good experience in that area (doctors are useless when it comes to AI diseases).

I had quite a few interactions with Walid. In my opinion he has a multiple personality disorder.

I harbor no ill feelings towards him infact based on his last post i actually feel sorry for him. I really hope he gets the help he needs and find solace in whatever decision he makes be it Ahlesunnah or Shiaism.

[Al-MuHammadee]

Or, could this be just another publicity/sympathy stunt by Wasil?

[Al-Afasy]

Ha! Another muqassir falls deeper in his taqseer. Let him eat it in the grave now.

Edited by Al-Afasy, 18 July 2012 - 12:42 PM.

[RevisitingTheSalaf]

According to the teachings of the Ahlulbayt (a.s) he is a apostate no doubt. It was brought to my attention recently he wanted to commit suicide. No surprise in that after all they accuse the holy Prophet (saw) of a similar thing. If they not blowing themselves up they they looking to shot themselves in the head. Just goes to show neanderthals we dealing with in the world. Allah (swt) guide the Nawaasb

[RevisitingTheSalaf]

I was informed this Nawaasb has recently posted something in another forum regrading my recent comments it is as follows:-

Quote

" ...i love sahabah al-kiram and ummahtol momineen .. radhiallahu ala abi bakr al-siddiq and omar al-farooq and othman alghani and ommahtil momineen all of them despite the haters and people with cold hearts"

Indeed you are a apostate according to our Aqeeda and our classical scholars such as Shaykh Saduq ibn Babawayhi (r.h) has also emphasised when dealing with individuals such as yourself.

On The Beliefs of the Shi'a Imamiya

CHAPTER 38

THE BELIEF CONCERNING EVIL-DOERS (zalimun) apostleship (nubuwwa).


And Imam Ja'far as-Sadiq said: He who doubts in the infidelity (kufr) of our enemies who have wronged us is himself an infidel (kafir)...

And our belief concerning him who fought 'Ali is that he was an unbeliever (kafir), on account of the saying of the Prophet, on whom be the blessings and peace of Allah; He, who fought 'Ali, fought me; and he, who waged war on 'Ali, waged war on me; and he, who waged war on me, did so against Allah. And (also) on account of his (Prophet's) saying to 'Ali, Fatima, Hasan and Husayn, peace on all of them: I am the enemy of those who wage war against you, and at peace with those who are at peace with you.

And as for Fatima, the blessings of Allah and His peace be on her, our belief is that she is the leader of the women of the world, both the earlier and the later ones. And verily Allah the Mighty and Glorious is wroth with him who evokes her anger, and is well-pleased with him who pleases her, for He has weaned. her and those who revere her from the Fire. And she left the world displeased with those who had wronged her and usurped her rights, and denied her the inheritance left by her father. The Prophet said: Verily, Fatima is a part of myself; he who angers her has angered me, and he who gladdens her has gladdened me. And the Prophet said: Verily Fatima is a part of myself, and she is my spirit (ruh) which is between my two flanks. What displeases her displeases me, and what gladdens her gladdens me.

http://www.sicm.org....e=suduk/Suduk38

At the end of this Jahils statement he suggested he loves all the mother of believers, interesting... on that very note I would like to ask this Jahil would you also love Qutaylah bint Qays  bin Ma'd Yakri al-Kindiya (la) who was also Ummal Momineen?

Qutaylah is the daughter of Qays son of Ma'ad Yukrib Al Kindya; sister of Ash'ath son of Qays. Messenger of Allah (saw) married her in the 10th year (of Hijra) but soon complained, he passed away; she wasn't brought to him and he never saw her neither did he enter her.  It was said that he married her a month before his death. It is also narrated that The Prophet (saw) willed to let her choose, if she wanted she could wear the veil and so she becomes forbidden for the Muslims, or if she wants she can divorce him so she can choose who she wants to marry. She chose to be seperated, so she was given a divorce and Ikrimah ibn Abi Jahl married her. So Abo Bakr was informed of this and he said: "I was urged to (thought of) burning the house over them" Umar in response said: "She is not the mother of believers, he didn't enter into her,or made her wear the veil".

(Note: Its interesting how Aboo Bakar wanted to burn the house over this women, one begins to think if this was a common practice, lets not forget what they did to the house off Bibi Faatima (s.a) )

It was said that the Messenger of Allah (saw) did not will for her anything, but did not enter into her, she apostatized with her brother when he apostatised and so then Ikrimah ibn Abi Jahl married her . Abu Bakr wanted to stone her but Umar said "The Holy Prophet did not enter her and she isn't Mother of the Believers so Allah is innocent of the apostatised so Abu Bakr was silent.

With regards to her (Qutaylah) and other wives of the Holy Prophet (saw) whom were not entered  there is great debate and skepticism, that has not resulted in any further benefit to the validation of the issue, and we have mentioned about every wife what  has been narrated about her. And Allah knows. Narrated by Abu Naim and Abu Umar and Abu Musa

Source: Usd ul-Ghabah, Pg. 234 - 235, Person # 7219

Qutaylah bint Qays  bin Ma'd Yakri al-Kindiya

She sister of Al-Ash'ath bin Qays

And the correct is Qatila. She married the Messenger of Allah - may blessings be upon him - in year 10, then he claimed on the half of Safar, then he WAS CATCHED (I.E. HIS LIFE WAS CATCHED BY Allah) on Monday for two days that passed on of Rabee' al-Awwal from the year 11. She had not come forth to him, and neither did he see her, nor 'enter' upon her. And some said: His marriage to her took place two months before his demise. And others claimed that he married her during his sickness.

And some of them said: That he (saw) ordered that she should be left to choose; if she wished, he would cast the veil on her and she would be prohibited for the believers; and if she wished, she would marry whoever she liked. So she chose marriage, then 'Ikrimah bin Abu-Jahl married her in Hadhramut, and when it (the news) reached Abo Bakr, he said: "I will burn their house upon them too!" Then Umar said to him: "She is not of the mothers of the believers, and neither did he (the Prophet) 'enter' upon her, nor did he cast the veil on her!".

And Al-Jarjani said: Her brother married her to him  (saw) then he (saw) died before she went out of Yemen. Then 'Ikrimah bin Abi-Jahl succeeded him (i.e. succeeded the Prophet in marrying her).

And some of them said: The Messenger of Allah (saw) did not order her anything, but she apostasized when her brother apostasized, so Umar argued to Abu Bakr that she is not of the wives of the Prophet (saw) due to her apostasy. And she did not give birth from 'Ikrimah bin Abu-Jahl, and there is a lot of of disagreement on her.

Source: Al-Isaba fi Tamyiz al-Sahaba, Vol. 2, Pg. 1903 - 1904 Person # 4069

Despite this believe in the Sheikhayn and claim to love all the mothers of believers?! Wala haula Wala quwata illa billah

Edited by RevisitingTheSalaf, 21 July 2012 - 02:33 AM.

[Al-MuHammadee]

So, Wasil was only playing on people‘s intelligence after all. I firstly fell for his trick. But, upon a rethink of his past “records“ (which includes racism, pornography, obscenity and dishonest stunts), I neatly caught him. His fake illness and suicide thinking are nothing but fake publicity and sympathy stunts. What a fool!

Wasil, I know you do check shiachat, and this thread in particular: so, could you tell us why you love Mu‘aawiyah, a clear Naasibi? Is it because he hated Imaam ‘Alee ?

[Sayyed Ali]

Al-MuHammadee, on 21 July 2012 - 02:38 AM, said:

So, Wasil was only playing on people‘s intelligence after all. I firstly fell for his trick. But, upon a rethink of his past “records“ (which includes racism, pornography, obscenity and dishonest stunts), I neatly caught him. His fake illness and suicide thinking are nothing but fake publicity and sympathy stunts. What a fool!

Wasil, I know you do check shiachat, and this thread in particular: so, could you tell us why you love Mu‘aawiyah, a clear Naasibi? Is it because he hated Imaam ‘Alee ?

he didnt say he love muawiya.
he accepts the first 3 khulafa who did mistake and he believes in imamate of ahl al bayt.

[Al-MuHammadee]

Sayyed Ali, on 21 July 2012 - 06:56 AM, said:

he didnt say he love muawiya. he accepts the first 3 khulafa who did mistake and he believes in imamate of ahl al bayt.

He says he now loves all the Sahaabah. Did you read his words properly?

And how exactly does he believe in the Imaamah of the Imaams ? How? Could you elaborate?

[Gypsy]

Al-MuHammadee, on 21 July 2012 - 02:38 AM, said:

So, Wasil was only playing on people‘s intelligence after all. I firstly fell for his trick. But, upon a rethink of his past “records“ (which includes racism, pornography, obscenity and dishonest stunts), I neatly caught him. His fake illness and suicide thinking are nothing but fake publicity and sympathy stunts. What a fool!

So he didn't blow his brain out with a gun?

You can't trust this guy at all.

Not that I wish him to do it,

he should really see someone about his extreme ups and downs. It could be a sign of some illness.

[Al-MuHammadee]

Gypsy, on 21 July 2012 - 08:00 AM, said:

So he didn't blow his brain out with a gun? You can't trust this guy at all. Not that I wish him to do it, he should really see someone about his extreme ups and downs. It could be a sign of some illness.

He is only a pretender.

[awaiting_for_the.12th]

Sayyed Ali, on 21 July 2012 - 06:56 AM, said:

he didnt say he love muawiya.
he accepts the first 3 khulafa who did mistake and he believes in imamate of ahl al bayt.

Cant believe this thread is still going. Anyways dont waste time on this. Someone with weak fundamentals was bound to collapse.
I personally believe he was tested with a hardship, which he failed, his faith collapsed and well rest Shaitan did its part. He probably thought that Allah punished him for being against sahabas etc. Then obviously the next step was to go to the opposite party. Historical examples are full of it that as soon as someone was dissatisfied with Imam Ali they would run to Muwaiya's camp (who would welcome them with open arms). Hence, he found his place among the lowest who make fun of the Imamat (the very thing he once used to defend).
I actually refer to his story to alot of my friends on how a person can flip sides in an instant.

[Sayyed Ali]

Al-MuHammadee, on 21 July 2012 - 07:33 AM, said:

He says he now loves all the Sahaabah. Did you read his words properly?

And how exactly does he believe in the Imaamah of the Imaams ? How? Could you elaborate?

He said in one thread( i didnt remember which one) that he still has problems with bani ummaya muawiya yazid etc...

[Sayyed Ali]

Today Wasil wrote in his Forum:

Quote

It seems i cannot be anything but shia. even when i thought i was sunni i didn't have the orthodox sunni beliefs. My illness made me think that my shi'ism was the cause of my ordeal but it appeared that this was not the case. I am a shia twelver and it's hard for me to fight it . I still believe sheikhain were not evil like all shias do and i believe umm almomineen must be respected no matter what ! all what i said on HCY forum still applies but the last few posts where i said i don't believe in twelve imams ! I was confused and i am still confused but i do believe in the twelve imams starting with ali(as) ending with sahib alzaman : imam al-mahdi .

[Haydar Husayn]

Wasil seems very confused. Does he believe that Imam `Ali was appointed by the Prophet or not? If not, then what significance is there to the 12 Imams ? Why should anyone follow them if they weren't appointed? And if `Ali was appointed, then Abu Bakr and `Umar rejected an order of the Prophet , which is kufr according to anyone.

[Darth Vader]

Remind me why I should give a dump about some guy named Walid or Faird or whatever the hell they believe in or don't believe in. Or perhaps enlighten me what was the whole point of this thread to begin with?

[Vigilare]

Darth Vader, on 27 December 2012 - 05:14 PM, said:

Remind me why I should give a dump about some guy named Walid or Faird or whatever the hell they believe in or don't believe in. Or perhaps enlighten me what was the whole point of this thread to begin with?

You don't need to care, but why then post in the thread?  Makes it a pointless post?

Anyway, whatever Wasil's  believing now is between him and Allah.