23 replies to this topic

[azamin]

Assalam-o-Allaikum,

People call him Ayat ullah.. Is Allama Aqeel Gharavi a Mujtahid?

[imranali]

 azamin, on 13 April 2010 - 06:05 AM, said:

Assalam-o-Allaikum,

People call him Ayat ullah.. Is Allama Aqeel Gharavi a Mujtahid?

He is not mujtahid ......

[azamin]

 imranali, on 13 April 2010 - 06:24 AM, said:

He is not mujtahid ......

Than why ppl call him Ayat ullah..

[Maitham]

 imranali, on 13 April 2010 - 06:24 AM, said:

He is not mujtahid ......

do you say that because he is called an ayatollah and therefore being past the stage of mujahid?

[imranali]

People call him marja ..... but he is not qualified to be called marja.

[Maitham]

 imranali, on 13 April 2010 - 06:47 AM, said:

People call him marja ..... but he is not qualified to be called marja.

I'm not acquainted with his fatwa however you have to provide solid proof that someone is not a mujahid or a marja by first comparing what he says on fiqh and seeing if that is different then sharia law. because even if someone is a low level mujahid they are perfected in only some area's. which would prove your claim wrong to say someone is not even a mujahid. now if it is a matter of different opinion on what he has said outside of fiqh then this is what he is likely has concluded in his studies and can differ to what others say.

so if your going to say someone is not a mujahid even. then bring us proof like that he tells us how to do wudu different or he cannot issues information on wudu and salat and fasting. and if your basing it on the second one (that is that he has opinion about something outside of fiqh) that you disagree with or that some of us would. this is not enough to say he is not this or that. each marja comes to conclusions and they are all fallible they can be mistaken or they can be right it is their duty to find what they feel is the truth and teach it.

Edited by AlMuttaqi, 13 April 2010 - 07:18 AM.

[ShiaSoldier@2007]

  

He sounds very high up there to me, if he isn't a mujtahid he is probably close. The thing is he is on wikipedia http://en.wikipedia....t_of_Ayatollahs not really reliable though. I don't doubt he is an ayatollah but be careful usual pakistanis call every Maulana an ayatollah or give him big titles like that.

[Basim Ali]

,
Don't listen to ignorant people.

He is an Ayatullah; though not a Grand Ayatullah/Marja.  
Listen to some of his lectures; his eloquence and knowledge reflect that he is no ordinary lecturer.

wa

Edited by Basim Ali, 13 April 2010 - 08:29 AM.

[syedhasan]

Dnt know

[imranali]

No body said he is not a great speaker ....... Kindly, find the person who said something like that ...... pointing out towards someone without base is not a good idea.

Allama Aqeel Gharvi is a great speaker but unfortunatelly, he is not a Marja-e-Taqleed.

[haideriam]

excellent knowledge and an excellent orator
but
recently i went to a majalis of his and there he was addressed as a hujjat ul islam and not an ayatullah in his own presence
sakina trust, approx 2 months ago

[sayed001]

 imranali, on 13 April 2010 - 06:24 AM, said:

He is not mujtahid ......

There is a difference between marja and mujtahid. a marja taqleed is one who as published an islamic laws

ayatollah gharavi is a mujtahid. wikipedia even states this and if you listen to him you can tell by his dialogue

http://en.wikipedia....qeel-ul-Gharavi

[imranali]

 haideriam, on 13 April 2010 - 12:40 PM, said:

excellent knowledge and an excellent orator
but
recently i went to a majalis of his and there he was addressed as a hujjat ul islam and not an ayatullah in his own presence
sakina trust, approx 2 months ago

There are lot to be said in this regard. Some people are trying their best to make him Marja which even he dont say to himself. good luck to them............

[haideriam]

 imranali, on 14 April 2010 - 08:22 AM, said:

There are lot to be said in this regard. Some people are trying their best to make him Marja which even he dont say to himself. good luck to them............

there is nothing to say bro
he is hujjat ul islam aqeel ul gharavi
till such time that he gets an ijaza from someone(his teacher)
and we can view the same

so no need of going over the top as well, just let him be
his majalis are excellent nonetheless

[imranali]

 haideriam, on 14 April 2010 - 12:27 PM, said:

there is nothing to say bro
he is hujjat ul islam aqeel ul gharavi
till such time that he gets an ijaza from someone(his teacher)
and we can view the same

so no need of going over the top as well, just let him be
his majalis are excellent nonetheless

I think you missed my point which I made earlier ....... I never said he is not a good speaker. He is doing his work nicely. He recites really good. Whenever, I have chance, I listen to his majalis ........ No debt about his ability of speaker.

I agree with you on the point that he need ijaza from his teacher, this statement is proof that he is not Marja-e-taqleed. since Marja-e-taqleed dont take Ijaza

[haideriam]

 imranali, on 15 April 2010 - 05:28 AM, said:

I think you missed my point which I made earlier ....... I never said he is not a good speaker. He is doing his work nicely. He recites really good. Whenever, I have chance, I listen to his majalis ........ No debt about his ability of speaker.

I agree with you on the point that he need ijaza from his teacher, this statement is proof that he is not Marja-e-taqleed. since Marja-e-taqleed dont take Ijaza

bro imran, seems you are confusing the two
ayatullah and marja /marja e taqleed
ayatullah is a much earlier stage
what i am saying that we have not seen an ijaza for him being an ayatullah yet
and hence they referred to him as hujjat ul islam at his speech at sakina trust, in his presence

[sayed001]

 haideriam, on 16 April 2010 - 02:46 AM, said:

bro imran, seems you are confusing the two
ayatullah and marja /marja e taqleed
ayatullah is a much earlier stage
what i am saying that we have not seen an ijaza for him being an ayatullah yet
and hence they referred to him as hujjat ul islam at his speech at sakina trust, in his presence

And in his presence and of the presence of other ulema at the Islamic Centre in Maidavale recently he was reffered to as Ayatollah Gharavi.

He is a Mujtahid as he has an ijaza from Ayatollah Nasir Makaram Shirazi (wikipedia & he has said this also)

[Aabiss_Shakari]

I think he has Ijaza from his teacher Ayatullah Makkarram Shirazi (a.r) and is a Mujtahid.

[haideriam]

 sayed001, on 16 April 2010 - 03:00 AM, said:

And in his presence and of the presence of other ulema at the Islamic Centre in Maidavale recently he was reffered to as Ayatollah Gharavi.

He is a Mujtahid as he has an ijaza from Ayatollah Nasir Makaram Shirazi (wikipedia & he has said this also)

 Aabiss_Shakari, on 16 April 2010 - 12:21 PM, said:

I think he has Ijaza from his teacher Ayatullah Makkarram Shirazi (a.r) and is a Mujtahid.

bro sayed0001, yes i know this majlis was just about 5 days after the sakina trust one
but don't you think the sakina trust people knew, the one's who had invited him for the majlis

bro aabis, i think you are right and i thought the same
but why can't we view the ijaza
and please let us not go down the wikipedia route

this thing had happened about 5 years ago in pakistan also, this same confusion
and eventually people started calling him hujjat ul islam thereafter

i have also heard that his ijaza is probably only 2/3 years old
his brother runs the ayatullah nasir makarim shirazi centre in harrow, london

[doobybrother]

Salam

Aqeel Gharvi sahb is definitely not a marjae taqleed since he hasnt taken out a risalah,but he is a mujtahid. He got ijazah from ayatollah makarem shirazi in 1994. Also if he is a mujtahid i think he can be called an ayatollah.

[haideriam]

 doobybrother, on 16 April 2010 - 02:59 PM, said:

Salam

Aqeel Gharvi sahb is definitely not a marjae taqleed since he hasnt taken out a risalah,but he is a mujtahid. He got ijazah from ayatollah makarem shirazi in 1994. Also if he is a mujtahid i think he can be called an ayatollah.

we are not going to doubt what you are saying bro,
can we see the ijaza if you are so sure

[doobybrother]

 haideriam, on 16 April 2010 - 03:23 PM, said:

we are not going to doubt what you are saying bro,
can we see the ijaza if you are so sure

Salam

Sorry brother i cant present you with any proof of his ijaza.Why am i so sure?..maybe because i heard from a reliable source.
Ill surely check if i can get my hands on the ijaza.

Regards

[husainshahid]

 azamin, on 13 April 2010 - 06:05 AM, said:

Assalam-o-Allaikum,

People call him Ayat ullah.. Is Allama Aqeel Gharavi a Mujtahid?

As Salam Alaykum

He IS a mujtahid. I asked him directly. He also has ijazas. Other senior ulema agree with this and agree he is a mujtahid. There is in fact no controversy on this except amongst lay persons who gossip and have sought to create controversy where there is none.
He is also learned. He will probably become a marja as he gets older and produces a resalah but he does not seem very ambitious for fame and glory.

I am not an ayatollater and from my posts you will see what kind of person I am - certainly no friend of the mullahs. And this critic of mullahs states from my research that Allama Aqeel Gharavi is a real mujtahid by usuli standards.  There is no controversy about him in learned circles.

Regarding socalled 'Grand Ayatullah' Makarim Shirazi I know from Gharawi's brother (Mulla Dhul Qadr) that the latter (Mulla Dhul Qadr) is Makarim Shirazi's representative in the UK. HOWEVER Allama Aqeel Gharavi himself is NOT his representative and does NOT even do Makarim Shirazi's taqlid (even if he got an ijaza from him according to someone on this site - unconfirmed). I asked him whose taqlid he himself does and he said some people like mujtahids (ie himself) do not have to do taqlid  - so he is not in the taqlid of a marja who are for the lay persons to emulate not necessarily other mujtahids if they respecfully believe they have superior views to the marjas.

Wa Salam

Edited by husainshahid, 17 April 2010 - 09:30 PM.

[haideriam]

does viewing an ijaza not remove doubt and create certainity

better than taking anyone's words on the internet, no disrespect meant to any