17 replies to this topic

[al_hiyam]

al salaam a'laykum! for initiating a contract mutah what are the procedures if you want to be a written document? what conditions are drawn up .. need some printed forms? or certain forms of sentences? what criteria should be kept in mind when you want the act (mutah) to be achieved under these circumstances (enrolled)?

[Hamzas]

al_hiyam, on 23 December 2009 - 04:03 PM, said:

al salaam a'laykum! for initiating a contract mutah what are the procedures if you want to be a written document? what conditions are drawn up .. need some printed forms? or certain forms of sentences? what criteria should be kept in mind when you want the act (mutah) to be achieved under these circumstances (enrolled)?

Which Ayatullahs allow Mutah with atheist or people who are not people of the book ?
also if your future wife had sex outside marriage does she still have to observe iddah ? and how are you suppose to force a non muslim to observe iddah ??

[al_hiyam]

Hamzas, on 27 December 2009 - 06:13 PM, said:

Which Ayatullahs allow Mutah with atheist or people who are not people of the book ?
also if your future wife had sex outside marriage does she still have to observe iddah ? and how are you suppose to force a non muslim to observe iddah ??

As salamu alaykum! First of all..only Shia Muslims alows contracting Mutah marriage,second of all, the existing "marja al taqlid"(Ayatollahs:..Sistani..Khoeimin..Sadr..etc) alows contracting temporary marriage(Mutah),or permanent marriage(Nikah)only with people who have monotheist religion. Marriages with people that have politheist religion are forbidden for Muslims .. polytheism is the worst sin ..Concerning the second question of yours,yes, she MUST observe Iddah!(for a women that had a permanent marriage she must wait 3 mounths,more exactly 3 periods..and for a wife from temporary marriage,she must wait 45 days..or 2 periods.!.if a man contracted a temporary marriage with a woman, and the period of her Iddah has not ended yet, he is allowed to contract a permanent marriage with her or renew a contract for temporary marriage with her.(but they must abstain from sexual relationship)....Finally,your third question..you cannot force no one for doing what you want. It s more important for them to understand what concerns this aspects..it s more important for them to realise that they could have a child.I

[murtazarizvi]

Salam.

I know its probably a very old question and a downbeaten one too, but i just want to know how to perform Mutaa. I am not asking if it is allowed or not, or your opinion about it.... Just how to do it. I am a muslim living in America and the girl i am planning to do mutaa with is englsih and cannot say arabic words and frankly neither can I. So can i just talk with her, tell her the conditions and will that be enough.... or are there like segheas to read like a permenant marriage.

Please help me out here. I am afraid that i may sin. I have been looking for answers to this question with no luck.

HELP  


please reply only if you are SURE. i dont want to end up later sinning, even tho Allah knows best wats in my heart

[fyst]

Try googling things once in a while.

http://www.al-islam....iage2.html#2430

http://www.al-islam....iage1.html#2379

Hamzas said:

Which Ayatullahs allow Mutah with atheist or people who are not people of the book ?

None.

Quote

also if your future wife had sex outside marriage does she still have to observe iddah ?

No.

Quote

and how are you suppose to force a non muslim to observe iddah ??

You don't.

[gespato]

why is muttah not allowed in sunni maslak??

[Abu Hadi]

murtazarizvi, on 05 January 2010 - 02:11 AM, said:

Salam.

I know its probably a very old question and a downbeaten one too, but i just want to know how to perform Mutaa. I am not asking if it is allowed or not, or your opinion about it.... Just how to do it. I am a muslim living in America and the girl i am planning to do mutaa with is englsih and cannot say arabic words and frankly neither can I. So can i just talk with her, tell her the conditions and will that be enough.... or are there like segheas to read like a permenant marriage.

Please help me out here. I am afraid that i may sin. I have been looking for answers to this question with no luck.

HELP  


please reply only if you are SURE. i dont want to end up later sinning, even tho Allah knows best wats in my heart

Salam.

Here is your answer.

http://www.revertmus....com/mutah.html

Edited by Abu Hadi, 07 July 2012 - 07:27 AM.

[coldcow]

gespato, on 06 July 2012 - 04:05 PM, said:

why is muttah not allowed in sunni maslak??

We tend to not follow anything that the first 3 Caliphs said or did, and don't trust the hadiths they report. Umar, the 2nd caliph, banned mutah while he was in power.

A quick googling came up with this: http://theauthenticb...utah-is-haraam/
Although I haven't read it yet.

[Abu Hadi]

It is a typical anti-shia rant using fake hadith them claiming them to be mutawattir. It is also using a false analogy

1) The author claims that the forbidding of mutah was gradual, like the prohibition of wine. In fact this analogy is deeply flawed. Mutah is explicity allowed in the Quran, Surat Nisa

وَالْمُحْصَنَاتُ مِنَ النِّسَاء إِلاَّ مَا مَلَكَتْ أَيْمَانُكُمْ كِتَابَ اللّهِ عَلَيْكُمْ وَأُحِلَّ لَكُم مَّا وَرَاء ذَلِكُمْ أَن تَبْتَغُواْ بِأَمْوَالِكُم مُّحْصِنِينَ غَيْرَ مُسَافِحِينَ فَمَا اسْتَمْتَعْتُم بِهِ مِنْهُنَّ فَآتُوهُنَّ أُجُورَهُنَّ فَرِيضَةً وَلاَ جُنَاحَ عَلَيْكُمْ فِيمَا تَرَاضَيْتُم بِهِ مِن بَعْدِ الْفَرِيضَةِ إِنَّ اللّهَ كَانَ عَلِيمًا حَكِيمًا (4:24)

4:24

All of the Shia and most of the Sunni commentators agree that the term 'istimtah' (highlighted in red) refers to zawajtul mutah, the marriage of mutah, which was practiced before Islam by the Arabs. The ayats does not ban the practice but says that 'as to those women whom you have done mutah with, give them their dowries (ujurahuna, their (f) dowries). Here is the English Traslation of the ayat from Islamicity, a Sunni site

And [forbidden to you are] all married women other than those whom you rightfully possess [through wedlock]: this is God's ordinance, binding upon you. But lawful to you are all [women] beyond these, for you to seek out, offering them of your possessions, taking them in honest wedlock, and not in fornication. And unto those with whom you desire to enjoy marriage, you shall give the dowers due to them; but you will incur no sin if, after [having agreed upon] this lawful due, you freely agree with one another upon anything [else]: behold, God is indeed all-knowing, wise

Of course, this English translation 'muddies the waters' and makes it seems as if both parts of the ayat are talking about the same type of marriage, whereas it is talking about marriage in general in the first part and a specific type of marriage (zawajtul mutah) in the second part starting from 'fama'. This is clear in Arabic.

So there is no equivalet ayat that permits alcohol. Alcohol was widely used in Arabic culture before Islam but it was never, ever sanctioned by the Prophet or Quran at any time. There is no ayat in the Quran that allows drinking alcohol and there are three ayats in the Quran that forbid it using different language. There is no ayat in the Quran that forbids mutah.

Also, the hadith that he cites are Ummayad forgeries that were copied. There are no Shia books that contain these hadiths, and even many Sunni scholars reject all of them or some of the as daif (weak). Sayying a hadith is mutawattir (received simulataneously with the same wording thru many different authors) does not make it mutawattir, just like saying something is haram does not make it haram. And he leaves out the many hadiths (which have already been posted many times here) from Sunni sources saying that mutah was allowed and practiced during the time of Rasoulallah and even during the time of Abu Bakr until Umar made it haram by his unjust decree.
He also leaves out the famous authentic hadith from Imam Ali(a.s) that says that 'If Umar wouldn't have forbidden mutah, noone would have committed zina (adultry) except the wretched'.

Edited by Abu Hadi, 15 July 2012 - 07:17 AM.

[coldcow]

Abu Hadi, on 15 July 2012 - 07:12 AM, said:

He also leaves out the famous authentic hadith from Imam Ali(a.s) that says that 'If Umar wouldn't have forbidden mutah, noone would have committed zina (adultry) except the wretched'.

That would appear to be common sense.  If a crime is legal, is it really a crime?

But why didn't Imam Ali allow mutah when he became Caliph?

[HellHound]

coldcow, on 15 July 2012 - 07:50 AM, said:

That would appear to be common sense.  If a crime is legal, is it really a crime?

But why didn't Imam Ali allow mutah when he became Caliph?

Who says he didn't?

[Haydar Husayn]

Abu Hadi, on 15 July 2012 - 07:12 AM, said:

Also, the hadith that he cites are Ummayad forgeries that were copied. There are no Shia books that contain these hadiths, and even many Sunni scholars reject all of them or some of the as daif (weak).

At least one of those hadiths did find it's way into Shia books:

[ 26387 ] 32 ـ محمد بن الحسن بإسناده ( عن محمد بن أحمد بن يحيى ، عن أبي جعفر ) ، عن أبي الجوزاء ، عن الحسين بن علوان ، عن عمرو بن خالد ، عن زيد بن علي ، عن آبائه عن علي ( عليهم السلام ) قال : حرم رسول الله ( صلى الله عليه وآله ) يوم خيبر لحوم الحمر الاهلية ونكاح المتعة .

32 – Muhammad b. al-Hasan by his isnad from Muhammad b. Ahmad b. Yahya from Abu Ja`far [from Muhammad b. Yahya – in at-Tahdheeb] from Abu ‘l-Jawza from al-Husayn b. `Ulwan from `Amr b. Khalid from Zayd b. `Ali from his fathers عليهم السلام from `Ali عليه السلام.  He said: The Messenger of Allah صلى الله عليه وآله forbade the meat of the domestic donkey and the mut`a marriage on the day of Khaybar.
http://www.tashayyu..../muta/chapter-1

But it makes no sense to interpret this as making mut`a forbidden, since we know it was allowed at a later time during the conquest of Mecca. So it could be that it was just a temporary ban on that one day.

[Abu Hadi]

I stand corrected. I meant the ones that forbid mutah are not found in the Shia books.
This hadith (if it is authentic) would forbid mutah only for a limited period of time, as you stated, and your logic is correct on this point.

[coldcow]

Replicant, on 15 July 2012 - 07:53 AM, said:

Who says he didn't?

Who says he did?  While I'll admit I haven't spent much time researching the topic, I have never heard anyone say that he undid Umar's ruling.  So did he?

Haydar Husayn, on 15 July 2012 - 09:01 AM, said:

But it makes no sense to interpret this as making mut`a forbidden, since we know it was allowed at a later time during the conquest of Mecca. So it could be that it was just a temporary ban on that one day.

Again, I don't know much on the topic, but what if what you're saying is actually the opposite - it was forbidden, but it was temporary allowed during the conquest of Mecca?

[HellHound]

coldcow, on 15 July 2012 - 11:29 AM, said:

Who says he did?  While I'll admit I haven't spent much time researching the topic, I have never heard anyone say that he undid Umar's ruling.  So did he?

Have you read any of the ahadith in which Imam Ali has condemned Umar multiple times for banning Mutah, among other things?

What does that tell you?

[Haydar Husayn]

coldcow, on 15 July 2012 - 11:29 AM, said:

Again, I don't know much on the topic, but what if what you're saying is actually the opposite - it was forbidden, but it was temporary allowed during the conquest of Mecca?

The problem is everyone agrees that mut`a was allowed in the Qur'an, and there is no ayah abrogating it. In addition, you would have to believe that the mut`a was allowed, then banned (on khaybar), and then allowed again (during the victory of Mecca), and then banned again. This doesn't make too much sense. Surely the distance between Medina and Mecca wasn't so great that the Muslims were in dire need of doing mut`a?

Anyway, we have tons of ahadith from the Imams , telling us that mut`a is allowed.

[coldcow]

HellHound, on 17 July 2012 - 12:30 AM, said:

Have you read any of the ahadith in which Imam Ali has condemned Umar multiple times for banning Mutah, among other things?

What does that tell you?

No, I'm sorry, I've never read those hadiths.

But if you know the answer to my question, can you please let me know if he specifically overturned Umar's ruling on the matter when he became the caliph?  If he did, then that should remove all controversy.  If he didn't, then he either agreed, or he thought the ban wasn't as big of a deal as we make it out to be today, and he had more important things to take care of.

[Logical Islam]

No witnesses needed.

If she lives with her father or parents, or is dependent on them financially ect , you need to request permission

Or if she is a virgin

If not, then no witnesses , no fuss

CHECK YOUR MARJAH