38 replies to this topic

[Researcher]

Irishman, on 22 September 2009 - 12:15 PM, said:

So we are not at appropriate doses for cannabis?. How can one measure accurately the strength of cannabis, as they mainly come from illegal sources and there are many different plants with different strengths. Treating kids with an already existing medical disorder is different to putting cannabis into a normal working mind. Cannabis is a good painkiller for some medical conditions also, but there again, it is being used to treat something, and not as a recreational drug.

Regarding dosage, it is an easy enough matter to prepare hash oil and then dilute it as needed. I am interested in what you consider a 'recreational drug'. I understand people use alcohol recreationally, but when people smoke cannabis, whether we agree with this or not, they are usually in tune with some higher purpose. For example they withdraw inwardly and meditate whether on themselves or some other object, or they compose some music or poetry or produce some kind of art. I can't really see anyone smoking cannabis just for recreation. Drunks abuse people and forget God. A person on cannabis doesn't do either of those things.

[seyedmusawi]

Its haram according to the maraja. That is all that is necessary to know right now.

[Mr. Anteater]

Marijuana is a gateway drug.

leads to other drugs like meth, crack, cocaine, heroin, mushrooms, extacy...etc.

These are all bad for you.

Plus it makes you fat and lazy. Which is not good either, this makes you a useless member of society.

[_jen_]

Farhadfarsi83, on 25 September 2009 - 01:14 AM, said:

Marijuana is a gateway drug.

leads to other drugs like meth, crack, cocaine, heroin, mushrooms, extacy...etc.

These are all bad for you.

Plus it makes you fat and lazy. Which is not good either, this makes you a useless member of society.

Astaghfirullah like..

That is a bit of a generalisation.

Anyhow, i agree with Researcher. Although, it can cause paranoia and other problems...but thats with constant and prolonged used. i actually think smokin it now and then is quite healthy. (im not encouraging anyone to use it, before mods start twisting my words )

[Fiasco]

Farhadfarsi83, on 25 September 2009 - 01:14 AM, said:

Marijuana is a gateway drug.

leads to other drugs like meth, crack, cocaine, heroin, mushrooms, extacy...etc.

These are all bad for you.

Plus it makes you fat and lazy. Which is not good either, this makes you a useless member of society.

Not everyone, but yes for some this is very true. A friend of mine started with marijuana and it led to experiment with more lethal drugs like meth, crack and so forth.

[Mr. Anteater]

Everyone i know who started with marijuana ended up doing NOS, then xtacy...then cocaine....then mushrooms...Its a horrible pattern. most people who smoke also drink alcohol. Even ciggarettes are bad for you. In islam we say that even music is haraam. Then what makes you guys think that marijuana is ok? These things are better to stay away from. They are the temptations of shaitan. Again, if its for medical use, then i think its fine. I'm not sure what the ruling is on this, but im sure its not good to do it. If you've ever gotten high, then you know it intoxicates you. Makes you slower, you lose short term memory, you eat without control, the only good thing is for people with terminal illness who need to gain wait to stay alive longer. But if you look at the big picture, marijuana is bad for you. First you start smoking, then you end up celebrating meaningless holidays like 420.. IT IS ADDICTING AND IT IS BAD! Think of it this way, if you had kids, would you want them to start smoking? If you have any sense you would say no, because smoking causes cancer. If you smoke weed, you start needing it for all social gatherings too. It is overrated, and everyone these days does it, which is very sad. What happened to good old fashion fun, like playing soccer, basketball, cards...things that make you use your brain and physical activity...I wish i could do these things...And I hope that Allah (SWT) keeps all of us away from these temptations, including me.

[Researcher]

Cigarettes, not cannabis, are the gateway drug, according to research. Most addicts of meth, coke, heroin started (and continued) as cigarette smokers. Incidentally, cigarettes are most addictive than any of those drugs. Whereas people who smoke cannabis are drawn from all walks of life and are not necessarily the dregs of society (I don't mean that in a condescending way - just a fact). Most people who consume cannabis never touch other illegal drugs (as the effects of those are completely different). It seems fair to regard coke, meth, heroin users as self-medicating depressives or at least people with serious psychological problems - not 'normals'.

Smoking weed doesn't make someone a Rastafarian (or make them apostates from Islam) either, and many Rastas don't smoke.

[Researcher]

Farhadfarsi83, on 25 September 2009 - 05:29 AM, said:

Everyone i know who started with marijuana ended up doing NOS, then xtacy...then cocaine....then mushrooms...Its a horrible pattern.

That has not been my experience at all. I can only surmise that we have seen two different sides of life, or 'two sides of the fence'. Nobody I know has ever 'graduated' to the cycle of misery of hard drugs you describe. I think your experience is highly unusual. Furthermore cannabis and shrooms are alike, and completely dissimilar from cocaine and ecstasy, so the abuse pattern you indicated seems spurious.

Quote

most people who smoke also drink alcohol.

Alcohol is haram, there's no doubt about it and there exist clear references to alcohol consumption in the Islamic sources of law.

Quote

Even ciggarettes are bad for you.

I agree, very much so, but that doesn't necessarily make them haram.

Quote

In islam we say that even music is haraam.

SOME people say this. It is not universally accepted that ALL music is haram. The music you refer to is probably that MTV 'pop' garbage, which is of course disgusting and clearly haram.

Quote

Then what makes you guys think that marijuana is ok?

The question is, why do some people think it is haram if it is not mentioned by name in the Islamic sources of law? Cannabis is a mild hallucinogen, like shrooms or many foodstuffs (in high doses) that you probably eat all the time.

Quote

These things are better to stay away from. They are the temptations of shaitan.

What is the authority for saying that Shaytaan tempts people with cannabis? People commit haram acts under the influence of alcohol, not cannabis. It seems more reasonable that Shaytaan tempts people under the influence of alcohol.

Quote

If you've ever gotten high, then you know it intoxicates you.

Toxicity refers to 'poison'. The liver protects the body by rejecting poisons such as alcohol. It does not react in a similar way when there is cannabis in the blood. Cannabis will just stay there, doing no damage, until the cycle of water has flushed it out, which can take perhaps a month.

Quote

First you start smoking, then you end up celebrating meaningless holidays like 420.. IT IS ADDICTING AND IT IS BAD!

No, there are no such holidays such as this '420', and it is not addicting, even slightly.

Quote

Think of it this way, if you had kids, would you want them to start smoking? If you have any sense you would say no, because smoking causes cancer. If you smoke weed, you start needing it for all social gatherings too. It is overrated, and everyone these days does it, which is very sad. What happened to good old fashion fun, like playing soccer, basketball, cards...things that make you use your brain and physical activity...I wish i could do these things...And I hope that Allah (SWT) keeps all of us away from these temptations, including me.

I'm not saying people should smoke weed, but if they choose to do it and someone says it's haram, it is fair to ask for sources for saying it's haram. Not as many people smoke weed as you say. It is a small percentage of the population who like this stuff. Most of the people drink alcohol.

[A true Sunni]

Those who wish to smoke weed will always look to find a reason to smoke it . Regardless of the evidence or for that matter the law in many western countries prohibiting.

Also seems to be rather connected to the pseudo malangs and their way of life. Says it all really.

[.InshAllah.]

According to new research, regular users (of cannabis) double their risk of psychosis but heavy skunk users increase theirs seven-fold.

http://news.bbc.co.u...lth/8386344.stm

[noproblem]

Researcher, on 22 September 2009 - 03:08 PM, said:

Regarding dosage, it is an easy enough matter to prepare hash oil and then dilute it as needed. I am interested in what you consider a 'recreational drug'. I understand people use alcohol recreationally, but when people smoke cannabis, whether we agree with this or not, they are usually in tune with some higher purpose. For example they withdraw inwardly and meditate whether on themselves or some other object, or they compose some music or poetry or produce some kind of art. I can't really see anyone smoking cannabis just for recreation. Drunks abuse people and forget God. A person on cannabis doesn't do either of those things.

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOL- bro when i read this i just laughed so hard i couldn't stop...obviously you haven't smoked weed or don't have any experience with quality weed- maybe your dealer ripped you off- ANYONE who smokes up KNOWS that they do it for fun...almost all the people i know smoke marijuana for recreation and i know a lot of smokers...plus the part about only drunks forgetting god is laughable- since weed enhances many of your physical senses so it also affects how you perceive the world around you...and the way you react to everything.

Weed is HARAM because it has the same affects as alcohol- EXCEPT when used for medical reasons. Maybe you have a real bad headache some kind  of migrane that the paracetomol doesn't work on- maybe you can take a hit of the marijuana but not fior the intention to get high!..this is what logic dictates and what the islamic religion advocates. The idea of getting HIGH=the idea of getting drunk the only thing is it is a different buzz

[kadhim]

Researcher, on 21 September 2009 - 11:50 AM, said:

'Intoxicant' means 'poison'.

Ganja, weed, bhang is not an intoxicant. Alcohol will kill you if enough of it (a very small amount) reaches your brain. Cannabis will not. There is no authority for the hypothesis that anything that alters your mind is haram. Many substances drunk, eaten or inhaled are mildly psychoactive. I'm not encouraging people to go and smoke weed, but if there's nothing in all the laws of Islam that single it out and define it specifically as an 'intoxicant' (which, medically, it's not) then you can't say it's haram.

Intoxicant is just the word that was chosen as the closest fit in English. The Islamic term is muskir, which refers to anything blocking or impairing reason. It has nothing necessarily to do with toxicity, per se.

[kadhim]

Researcher, on 22 September 2009 - 03:08 PM, said:

Regarding dosage, it is an easy enough matter to prepare hash oil and then dilute it as needed. I am interested in what you consider a 'recreational drug'. I understand people use alcohol recreationally, but when people smoke cannabis, whether we agree with this or not, they are usually in tune with some higher purpose. For example they withdraw inwardly and meditate whether on themselves or some other object, or they compose some music or poetry or produce some kind of art. I can't really see anyone smoking cannabis just for recreation. Drunks abuse people and forget God. A person on cannabis doesn't do either of those things.

Man, as someone who smoked a few in his pre-Islamic days, give me a break. Yeah, there are the meditation and reflection and comtemplation types - I liked it for that myself back in the day. But have some honesty - that's a minority in terms of usual usage. More typical usage is to get blazed, watch Dazed and confused, and eat chips and pizza.

[89jghur32]

Researcher, on 22 September 2009 - 03:08 PM, said:

Regarding dosage, it is an easy enough matter to prepare hash oil and then dilute it as needed. I am interested in what you consider a 'recreational drug'. I understand people use alcohol recreationally, but when people smoke cannabis, whether we agree with this or not, they are usually in tune with some higher purpose. For example they withdraw inwardly and meditate whether on themselves or some other object, or they compose some music or poetry or produce some kind of art. I can't really see anyone smoking cannabis just for recreation. Drunks abuse people and forget God. A person on cannabis doesn't do either of those things.

Since you make the claim that "when people smoke cannabis, whether we agree with this or not, they are usually in tune with some higher purpose," then should we also consider the legal status of LSD, shroom and other hallucinogenic drugs?  Historically, these drugs have also been used to attain some sort of higher spiritual station.  Yet, in the process, people have committed suicide due to a distorted perception of reality.