24 replies to this topic

[hijab zehra]

salam......

My question is regarding the issue of ''Muta (temprory marrige)'' in islam and its authentic quotations of Masoomeen a.s.
Is it Halal in our relegion?
Can a married men have it in the absence of their wives?
Is it halal with non muslim women as well?
Are the muta children halal when its just a temprory marrige?even just for few hours or days?
And if it is then why most of the women dont like it about their husbands in their absence?
Living in the westren country,its very important for shia momneen to know about this fact before commiting a sin of zina.
And how do you people think about it?Is it right or worng?
Please let me know about your precious knowledge is it right or wrong?

Wasalam....

Iltemas e dua

[dingdong]

Marriage secures half your deen and is a very good act. In Islam you cna have two types of marriage i.e nikah and muta.

It is 100% halal and there are many hadiths about it from the ma'sooms. If you want I can provide you with them.

Yes a married man can marry more women in muta or even in nikah even in the presence of the wives.

Depending on your marja, it is allowed with non Muslim women. It is allowed with the ahlul kitab and AFAIK according to Ayatollah Saanei it is even allowed with non ahlul kitab with some limitations and conditions.

Muta is marriage. Children from marriage are legitimate. Children form nikah or muta are both legitimate and get the same rights AFAIK.

Nowadays jealousy is creeping into women. Jealousy in women has been equated to kufr. This is a bad thing in women and they should try to control it just like everyone tries to control themselves from their bad habits like lying and backbiting. They might also be under the impression that men are just like themselves i.e one partner being enough or even desirable. But the reality is that men are polygamous by nature and desire multiple partners.

Living anywhere in the world people should be aware of this option and in the unfortunate circumstances where they are unable to prevent themselves from haram ( ), they should atleast contract muta in order to make it halal.

Muta is a mercy of Allah and it is a good thing. It is His Wisdom which allowed it for us. There is no doubt that it should be encouraged and it is a good thing as it prevents us from haram. Imagine how hard it would be if preventing yourself from haram HAD to be in the form of a permanent marriage. There is also no doubt that it is right and not wrong. It is a popular hadith but dont take my word about it that Imam Ali said that had Umar not banned muta, no one would commit zina except the very wretched.

All the sexual corruption today can be solved if people actually follow the complete Islamic marriage structure. We are muslims. We have to follow Islam. If I said I love Allah a lot and I want to show it so I should go pray and then I went to the church and prayed, would it be right? It would be stupid because I am a muslim so I should pray in the muslim way. In the same way marriage is also a form of worship and as Muslims we should marry in the Islamic way not Hinu or Christian or whatnot.

Edited by dingdong, 06 May 2008 - 11:54 AM.

[Veiled]

Assalamaualykum

Yes please can you post the hadiths, etc.  

Is a muta valid if conditions are not met?  E.g.  Ayatullah Sistani says you need first wifes permission before temp marriage with non-muslim.  So if a guy has muta with a non-muslim behind his wifes back, is the muta contract void and instead a sin occured?

Also please can you post whether our Prophet and Imams (PBUT) have said it is better to divorce your wife and gain act of mustahab muta several times, even if the wife's reason is jealousy?

Please do not put the reason for women not liking polygomy at the fault of the women.  Maybe if the men treated them equally and honsty and love and respect, they would be open to the idea.  Maybe the men these days have set a poor example and this is what puts women off rather than jealousy.

Salaam

[Toronto110]

Oh my God!
Not another Muta thread.  

Sister, please use the search engine of this forum and I guess you will find Muta as the most hotly debated issue

[Veiled]

yes, i agree but i had to just cut in instantly with brothers comment about jealousy.

[Toronto110]

dingdong, on May 6 2008, 11:11 AM, said:

Marriage secures half your deen and is a very good act. In Islam you cna have two types of marriage i.e nikah and muta.

It is 100% halal and there are many hadiths about it from the ma'sooms. If you want I can provide you with them.

Yes a married man can marry more women in muta or even in nikah even in the presence of the wives.

Depending on your marja, it is allowed with non Muslim women. It is allowed with the ahlul kitab and AFAIK according to Ayatollah Saanei it is even allowed with non ahlul kitab with some limitations and conditions.

Muta is marriage. Children from marriage are legitimate. Children form nikah or muta are both legitimate and get the same rights AFAIK.

Nowadays jealousy is creeping into women. Jealousy in women has been equated to kufr. This is a bad thing in women and they should try to control it just like everyone tries to control themselves from their bad habits like lying and backbiting. They might also be under the impression that men are just like themselves i.e one partner being enough or even desirable. But the reality is that men are polygamous by nature and desire multiple partners.

Living anywhere in the world people should be aware of this option and in the unfortunate circumstances where they are unable to prevent themselves from haram (), they should atleast contract muta in order to make it halal.

Muta is a mercy of Allah and it is a good thing. It is His Wisdom which allowed it for us. There is no doubt that it should be encouraged and it is a good thing as it prevents us from haram. Imagine how hard it would be if preventing yourself from haram was as hard as a permanent marriage. There is also no doubt that it is right and not wrong. It is a popular hadith but dont take my word about it that Imam Ali said that had Umar not banned muta, no one would commit zina except the very wretched.

All the sexual corruption today can be solved if people actually follow the complete Islamic marriage structure. We are muslims. We have to follow Islam. If I said I love Allah a lot and I want to show it so I should go pray and then I went to the church and prayed, would it be right? It would be stupid because I am a muslim so I should pray in the muslim way. In the same way marriage is also a form of worship and as Muslims we should marry in the Islamic way not Hinu or Christian or whatnot.

MashaAllah brother dingdong, you being so young and you took the challenge of all these sisters with such an open post. Bravo your courage

Anyway, to clarify your situation as you are a muqallid of Agha Sistani. You cannot do muta with a virgin girl without father's permission. You should not do muta if you are married with a chaste and healthy wife. (obviously we inidan/pakistanis have a very sound excuse that our women are mentally challenged so they are not healthy, but truly speaking, with Allah (SWT) this excuse will not work).
Rest I second your opinion, especially about spreading the message, but with a bit of reservation, for which I will write about it in a second.

[dingdong]

I am just talking about the laws. I have heard that atleast one marja has given a direct fatwa that kindness to wives is wajib.

I dont know if it will be valid or not but I think a sin would occur. Remember we have to face Allah on the day of Judgment.

It all depends on your marja. Like Ayatollah Sistani says muta with nonmuslim women is as per obligatory precaution not allowed when you already have a Muslim wife.

Whether the Imams have said that you should divorce your wife for multiple mutas I dont know but I think muta is not here to replace nikah.

I dont know who did this (prolly satanic people) but I think that nowadays whenever the word multiple marriage or something comes up, people automatically think that it involves being unkind with your wives. I dont know why this happens. There are sooooo many cases where wives have been treated badly in first monogamous marriages but no one seems to imagine monogamous marriage as involving unkindness and stuff.

I dont know were the topic of dealing with kindness with the wives came but just tell me what kind of a person would claim to be doing multiple marriages for the sake of Allah and on the other hand treat his wives with unkindness? Thats kind of hypocritical. Dont you think so?

Personally, if theres been a war or somehting (we seem to have plenty nowadays )and there are a lot of widows and stuff, I think it would be a good idea if men would keep one permanent wife who they really love and are attached to (who are like a friend) and then contract muta with a reasonable amount of women not just for sex but for other reasons as well. No man would look at the women with bad intentions because the women are married women and theres no chance of zina with them. As the couple would now be MARRIED, i.e relatives, as per akhlaq, they would help each other informally beyond what Islam requires us to do. I mean if lets say for example some stranger asked you to take him to the airport in the middle of the night, you would be reluctant to do it. But if a relative asked you, then you wouldnt hesitate.

We should always marry muslim women first and then think about nonmuslims. Even in muta we shouldnt just marry for looks and beauty (another assumption people make), we should marry those who have a good deen and akhlaq, are respectable, honorable and chaste.

Yes I completely agree that many men kind of mess up their marriages when they go polygamous. But we should learn to be selfless and forgive others so maybe if the men had some more self sacrifice or something, these marriages would be more successful.

Toronto110, on May 6 2008, 08:40 PM, said:

MashaAllah brother dingdong, you being so young and you took the challenge of all these sisters with such an open post. Bravo your courage

Anyway, to clarify your situation as you are a muqallid of Agha Sistani. You cannot do muta with a virgin girl without father's permission. You should not do muta if you are married with a chaste and healthy wife. (obviously we inidan/pakistanis have a very sound excuse that our women are mentally challenged so they are not healthy, but truly speaking, with Allah (SWT) this excuse will not work).
Rest I second your opinion, especially about spreading the message, but with a bit of reservation, for which I will write about it in a second.

Yes absolutely. This law about the father or grand faths permission is IMO very important as some bad men could lead young irresponsible girls into something they wouldnt want to do.

Before doing anything funny, we should take into consideration ALL the laws availble and apply them ALL to the situation and then act. It would be best done by an alim with knowledgeof advanced laws.

I dont know why good dignified men in society in general dont perform muta as though it is corruption. Its normally only the failure marriages or bad marriages which involve muta.

Edited by dingdong, 06 May 2008 - 11:56 AM.

[hubbe_hussein110]

hijab zehra, on May 6 2008, 10:35 AM, said:

salam......

My question is regarding the issue of ''Muta (temprory marrige)'' in islam and its authentic quotations of Masoomeen a.s.
Is it Halal in our relegion?
Can a married men have it in the absence of their wives?
Is it halal with non muslim women as well?
Are the muta children halal when its just a temprory marrige?even just for few hours or days?
And if it is then why most of the women dont like it about their husbands in their absence?
Living in the westren country,its very important for shia momneen to know about this fact before commiting a sin of zina.
And how do you people think about it?Is it right or worng?
Please let me know about your precious knowledge is it right or wrong?

Wasalam....

Iltemas e dua

,

- Mutah is totally halal and has been mentioned by many of the Masoomeens in their traditions.

- Mutah can only be done with ahlul-kitab ie. Jews, Christians and Muslims

- Mutah children are legit children and the responsibily for the mother and father are the same as they would be during permanent marriage.

Personally even after knowing that mutah is halal, I think one should practice patience till they're permanently marriage and only then gain pleasure/companionship from their spouse. But if you are really desperate and know you may fall into sin and cannot afford a permanent marriage, then mutah is a way out. But it should be the last resort in that scenario. There are also other ways in which mutah could be a beneficial thing to do, for example if you are engaged and want to get to know your parnter more by going out with them, then you can do mutah with conditions and then there's no wrong in going out with your fiance.

I think you should check with you marja about specific questions regarding mutah.

Edited by Hubbe_Hussein110, 06 May 2008 - 12:22 PM.

[UMG]

hijab zehra, on May 6 2008, 09:35 AM, said:

Are the muta children halal when its just a temprory marrige?

Are there any type of children that are considered "haraam"?

[Cyan_Garamond]

It is for sexual and companionship needs of men in general, but it can be used for many other purposes.  Regarding if one has a Muslim wife, I believe a certain Imam was asked by a man regarding mutah; he was told basically that mutah has little to do with you (considering that you have a wife).  However, it is difficult to extrapolate the general rule for this for certain because the men may have had other conditions also.

There is another hadith about the greatness of mutah and that every man should it at least once in his life or something.

Personally, I think we need not worry too much about these issues.  Life is full of different and complex situations; as long as we try our best to be good and just, we will make it out with good conscience somehow.

Mr. Dingdong, one word of advice for you my friend.  You are a young man and don't know much; true knowledge is not what you read in books or risala, it is the knowledge you live and experience and learn firsthand.  Don't be too quick to judge others or their situation; you can never totally know who they are or what they face.

[Toronto110]

dingdong, on May 6 2008, 11:47 AM, said:

I dont know why good dignified men in society in general dont perform muta as though it is corruption. Its normally only the failure marriages or bad marriages which involve muta.

Ha Ha  

Brother, How can you say that. Remember, dignified or undignified men, no one would do such a personal stuff and tell the whole world about it.
It is a Mustahib act, but keeping sharm o Haya is wajib.

[dingdong]

^WHAAAAT? Isnt it MUSTAHAB to announce it in a mosque? And how exactly is it against sharmo haya to get married? Its marriage. People shoud be happy. If its possible there should be a modest ceremony to celebrate the union of two people.

Cyan: Yeah i am not judging folk specifically. Just judging the general society, not anyone in particular. And I mean that it is kind of sad that the people in general have made up society into such a situation that Islamic culture is getting hard to practice.  Even I myself am a respectable and honorable person in society but I aint doing muta. So if I were pointing at someone the first one should have been myself.

[hijab zehra]

UMG, on May 6 2008, 05:46 PM, said:

Are there any type of children that are considered "haraam"?

Yes ofcourse!!!
chidren,being concevied in zina are haraam in islam.

[hijab zehra]

dingdong, on May 6 2008, 04:11 PM, said:

Marriage secures half your deen and is a very good act. In Islam you cna have two types of marriage i.e nikah and muta.

It is 100% halal and there are many hadiths about it from the ma'sooms. If you want I can provide you with them.

Yes a married man can marry more women in muta or even in nikah even in the presence of the wives.

Depending on your marja, it is allowed with non Muslim women. It is allowed with the ahlul kitab and AFAIK according to Ayatollah Saanei it is even allowed with non ahlul kitab with some limitations and conditions.

Muta is marriage. Children from marriage are legitimate. Children form nikah or muta are both legitimate and get the same rights AFAIK.

Nowadays jealousy is creeping into women. Jealousy in women has been equated to kufr. This is a bad thing in women and they should try to control it just like everyone tries to control themselves from their bad habits like lying and backbiting. They might also be under the impression that men are just like themselves i.e one partner being enough or even desirable. But the reality is that men are polygamous by nature and desire multiple partners.

Living anywhere in the world people should be aware of this option and in the unfortunate circumstances where they are unable to prevent themselves from haram ( ), they should atleast contract muta in order to make it halal.

Muta is a mercy of Allah and it is a good thing. It is His Wisdom which allowed it for us. There is no doubt that it should be encouraged and it is a good thing as it prevents us from haram. Imagine how hard it would be if preventing yourself from haram HAD to be in the form of a permanent marriage. There is also no doubt that it is right and not wrong. It is a popular hadith but dont take my word about it that Imam Ali said that had Umar not banned muta, no one would commit zina except the very wretched.

All the sexual corruption today can be solved if people actually follow the complete Islamic marriage structure. We are muslims. We have to follow Islam. If I said I love Allah a lot and I want to show it so I should go pray and then I went to the church and prayed, would it be right? It would be stupid because I am a muslim so I should pray in the muslim way. In the same way marriage is also a form of worship and as Muslims we should marry in the Islamic way not Hinu or Christian or whatnot.

hhhhhhhhhhhhmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Its quite clear now....
really our relegion has given us all the options to prevent us from haram and commiting sins!!!ALHAMDOLILAH
Now the question that is arising in my mind at this point is this that why Mola Ali a.s announced muta as halal again when hazrat umer had declared it haram?
And if Mola Ali a.s did,then do we have his qoute in black and white somewhere in our books?

wasalm

[Toronto110]

dingdong, on May 6 2008, 03:00 PM, said:

^WHAAAAT? Isnt it MUSTAHAB to announce it in a mosque? And how exactly is it against sharmo haya to get married? Its marriage. People shoud be happy. If its possible there should be a modest ceremony to celebrate the union of two people.

Cyan: Yeah i am not judging folk specifically. Just judging the general society, not anyone in particular. And I mean that it is kind of sad that the people in general have made up society into such a situation that Islamic culture is getting hard to practice.  Even I myself am a respectable and honorable person in society but I aint doing muta. So if I were pointing at someone the first one should have been myself.

It is complicated. Agha Sistani has a different view about social aspects of islamic rules and regulations. One thing which is allowed at in Canada may not be allowed in Dubai.
and brother, it might not be mustahib to announce it in a Masjid. And it might be mustahib to announce. It depends upon the situation.

But surely spreading the word is Mustahib, so that if anyone is in a situation where s/he has to use this blessing, s/he should be knowing about the details.

[dingdong]

^Oh ok. So if I do nikah at a young age, even that shouldnt be announced in the mosque right? Because according to SOME people young age marriages are not good and are always a result of lust and haram talk before marriage. So because of the opinion of these people, I should not do my nikah in a mosque? Is that right? Why are laws on muta and nikah different?

Seriously I am sort of fed up of Ayatollah Sistani's generalized laws. Here we have major wars between zanjeer zans and non zanjeer zans just trying to figure out whether it gives Shiaism a bad name or not. I am going to Najaf in August Insha Allah. If I get to meet some other marja and find him to be a good one who I am impressed with then I will change to him. An alim already told me somehting very interesting and logical which sort of discourages me from doing taqlid of marjas who sit at home most of the time. This was an alim who studied in Qom for 19 years not some frenzied Revolutionist. Anyways the other marjas I have noticed like Ayatollah Khamenei give direct and clear cut fatwas which make sense. I am very tired of these generalized fatwas of Ayatollah Sistani. Maybe others do it too but I wont follow them as well.

Anyways hija zahra (nice name ), yes this saying has been recorded in our books and AFAIK is generally considered authentic. I can request a brother who knows Arabic to give you hadithes about this topic if you want. What makes you call Umar as HADRAT Umar? Mola Ali made it halal because Allah made it halal and Umar, out of his own personal opinion made it haram (innovation/bidah). He had no right whatsoever to do it. So its obvious Imam Ali brought back what Allah has allowed us.

Muta is marriage, so the children from marriage are halali. I cant see any reason for them being haram or even getting less rights or being treated as 'lesser'. Personally, I would give them a preference because I know that some munafiq people in our societies will have demonized them and considered them as haram.

[Veiled]

dingdong, on May 7 2008, 06:51 PM, said:

^Seriously I am sort of fed up of Ayatollah Sistani's generalized laws. Here we have major wars between zanjeer zans and non zanjeer zans just trying to figure out whether it gives Shiaism a bad name or not. I am going to Najaf in August Insha Allah. If I get to meet some other marja and find him to be a good one who I am impressed with then I will change to him. An alim already told me somehting very interesting and logical which sort of discourages me from doing taqlid of marjas who sit at home most of the time. This was an alim who studied in Qom for 19 years not some frenzied Revolutionist. Anyways the other marjas I have noticed like Ayatollah Khamenei give direct and clear cut fatwas which make sense. I am very tired of these generalized fatwas of Ayatollah Sistani. Maybe others do it too but I wont follow them as well.

Salaam

Please be careful in judging a grand marja like this.  I have never met him (nor any other marja) but I have read a lot of his books on jurisprudence and i find them easy to follow.  I dont think he just sits at home.  And so what if he does, does this limit his knowledge?  How do you know our awaited One doesnt meet with him?  Does he need to leave his house for this?  For someone who sits at home he understands the west and young culture pretty well.  How is this possible?  How does he understand the times we live in so well?  Some rules are left open for our own Judgement and this is a good thing.  Actually for a person who understands between the lines, even these general rules are specific to those who are looking a true answer that Allah (SWT) will be pleased with.  It is mostly the types that look for loopholes that will find room for expansion in his rulings.

Salaam

[Toronto110]

dingdong, on May 7 2008, 01:51 PM, said:

Why are laws on muta and nikah different?

Why the laws of Mutah and Nikah are different?

Okay lets answer your question.

Please dont mind my explanation, but all is just for the sake of making you understand.

Nikah is permanent marriage                vs                  Mutah is temporary marriage
Sigha of Nikah is different                     vs                  sigha of Muta
Nikah's Ayat is different                        vs                  Muta's ayat is different

They both have different purpose that is why they both were kept separate from each other by Allah (SWT).

Just to give you an example, Water also goes into our body and food also goes into our body. Why Allah (SWT) chose to separate each other? I dont know. Allah (SWT) and Prophets (PBU Them) and Ahl e Bayt know.

And just a brotherly advice. Dont fed up with debates/differences at this stage of your life. You havent even entered the actual race. It is more bitter out there once you will graduate from Stanford and will work at McKenzie, inshaAllah.
At this stage you cannot decide many aspects of your life, how can you decide which is the biggest aalim of shia islam. It is the job of Ulema.
And frankly speaking, 19 years in Qom ul Muqaddas are like getting to learn the high school level of knowledge. Usually students get through Dars e Kharij or might get permission for ijtehaad in 19 or so years.
How can a 19 year educated will be able to tell the level of knowledge of people who are getting education for the past 68 years.
Please try to understand that Taqlid is not a process of democracy, it is a process through which we, illeterate, get through the quagmire of this trecherous world.

[Toronto110]

I don’t have the knowledge and I also believe you also don’t have the knowledge of Shariah to say that Agha Sistani’s or other Ayatullahs fatwas are not according to Islam. If someone believes otherwise, s/he is entitled to her/his thinking, beside that it is considered Haraam to say that a fatwa of a Marjaa level Ayatullah is wrong. That is why we cannot trust those people who commit one haraam (saying that the fatwa of Agha Sistani or Agha Khamenii is wrong) to protect the Ummah from Riba.

Please refer to Maulana Sadiq Hassan. His recent Q and A Dars, 4th Moharram,
http://lectures.huss...m.aspx?ALID=859
(which he recited in Leicester, UK) pointed out that it is Haraam to say that fatwa of any marjaa level person is wrong. Not just my marjaa, but any one’s marjaa. I follow Agha Sistani, but I cannot say anything wrong about fatawas of Ayatullah Saeed Hakim, Ayatullah Fadlullah or Ayatullah Khamenii.

[MOHIB E AHLAYBAIT]

hijab zehra, on May 7 2008, 11:45 AM, said:

the question that is arising in my mind at this point is this that why Mola Ali a.s announced muta as halal again when hazrat umer had declared it haram?

And if Mola Ali a.s did,then do we have his qoute in black and white somewhere in our books?

wasalm

Mola Ali never announced it as halal, as it was never haram. What omar did had nothing to do with islam. In islam it was allowed regardless of who haramofied it. Mola Ali just propogated the true religon.

[Steve]

Salaam,
Can one have mutah in Moharram and safar days? I would appreciate if anyone replies me back on this question.

[Jondab_Azdi]

Steve, on 28 November 2009 - 08:33 AM, said:

Salaam,
Can one have mutah in Moharram and safar days? I would appreciate if anyone replies me back on this question.

Legally(shar'an), it is permissible to marry(mutah) in Muharram / Safar.

w/s

[Steve]

Jondab_Azdi, on 28 November 2009 - 09:04 AM, said:

Legally(shar'an), it is permissible to marry(mutah) in Muharram / Safar.

w/s

Thanks for the reply, appreciate a lot.......so its permissiable.......can u post the arabic verse in english if u can.. would be easy for me....i can read it though but hard to understand each word

Edited by Steve, 28 November 2009 - 09:23 AM.

[alimohamad40]

Quote

How do you know our awaited One doesnt meet with him?

marji3 Sistani is a Mujtahid and has deep studies about history but he lacks the most fundamental requirement for leadership therefore he should not put himself forward as an imam but unfortunately he has....  
He takes the Khoms ( Haq of Imam) yet he says that he doesn't interfere in any politics!!!!!  
If you don't interfere in politics how could you take Haqul Imam?  
how could some one like that be in harmony with our awaited one?

Secondly which imam in the history of Islam has refrained from talking in public???   what is khutbatul juma about ?  
we get conflicting fatwas from his office which created big fitnah and its so simple for him to use his mouth and go on a sattelite TV and say I did not say "A" I said "B"

some said he said going to election is wajib and some said he said goign to electio nis haraam

and so on he is following the footsteps of Alkhoie,,  and if you want to know about alkhoie from an insider listen to his eldest son Abbas alkhoie

by the way khoie also had 4 wives and his son says he neglected the young wife!!!  I didn't take every word of Abbas Alkhoie but alot of what he says is true.

sorry off topic but back to the topic O.P.

people didn't follow Umars innovation even during his khilafa and imam Ali did allow it in his khilafa time

about why our society rejects the Islamic marriage structure is because we are a cursed nation as the prophet prophesied  

he said " you will follow the footsteps of the ones before you the Jews and Christians"
and he said " will come  a day where good is seen as bad and bad is seen as good,,,  the liar is praised and the truthful is condemned"

imam Ali said " each time one door of hallal is closed 1000 doors of haraam are opened"

Dingdong:
they always try to concentrate on your age but I see you make logical points, if i didnt know you i would think your a lot older than them cause i assume that wisdom and age are correlated...

You going to najaf???  
didnt you hear the hadeeth that says " at the age of Dhuhor Kufan will be EMPTY from faithful people"

If you want a scholar who has more knowledge in more issues than others then Mohamad Fadhlallah is a very good choice. I don't know others as knowledgeable , the non Arabic speaking ones find it hard to acquire knowledge.... but khaminie mahsallah improved his Arabic to a very high level..

[Don omar]

Quran 4:24,allow muta ,u can u muta with ahle kitab also,