33 replies to this topic

[Noor Ali]

Iran's position in linking of its interests to the Palestinian cause is hypocritical in light of the fact that it does not support other Muslims, such as those in Chechnya or India.

Must Palestinian cause be linked so closely to the fate of Iran?

Is there a difference between Muslims in Chechnya or India and the Muslims of Palestine?

Doesn't Russia's Red Army repress the Chechen Muslims?

Pakistani SHIAS are being mass slaughtered like ducks on a usual basis by fanatical sunnis. They have rights less than that of compared to animals in the west.

Why do Iran's ideological interests not demand that we support them as well?

What happened to Divine Justice?

I thought he was "representing" Imam Mahdi(The Lord Of Our Time, may Allah hasten his return). I thought he was the "Uli Amr".

.....Guess I was wrong.

Edited by Noor Ali, 04 October 2003 - 01:13 PM.

[pasdar1]

Salam un Alaykum,

Did you forget this thread already?

http://www.shiachat....showtopic=17905

Perhaps we are repeating what we already went through.

Iltemas e dua
Khodahafiz

[salmany]

Sallam u alaikum

Your analysis is all wrong. What makes you u beleive that Imam Khameini does not support the cause of the muslims in Chechnya or Kashmir? Has he made any explicit statement in this regard? As for the Shias in Pakistan wasnt Iran funding the Tehreek-e-Jafaaria? That is what i have heard.

Lets see:

1. Imam Khameini expressed his regret for the destruction of the Babri mosque and asked the Indian Prime minister to rebuild it.

2. He spoke up against Armenian injustice to Muslims.

3. He spoke up against the White House and said that America was responsible for the Bosnian situation.

4. He met the Pakistani Prime minister in 1994 and talked about extremism and how brotherhood should be established.

5. He in a speech talked about promoting ties with African nations in 1997.

6. He spoke against America for their activites in afghanistan and Sudan:

i do not know osama bin laden and i do not condone killing local and civilian people in tanzania and kenya, but the military action of the u.s. against sudan and afghanistan is as much condemnable as killing civilians in kenya and tanzania. the leader also said as far as the islamic iran is concerned the u.s. attacks against sudan and afghanistan is as much condemnable as is the killing of civilians by the taliban in mazar-i-sharif of afghanistan.

May Allah forgive you.

Sallam

[aZiZi]

Noor Ali, on Oct 4 2003, 01:12 PM, said:

Pakistani SHIAS are being mass slaughtered like ducks on a usual basis by fanatical sunnis. They have rights less than that of compared to animals in the west.

I think that's because America is so "cool" with Pakistan...

[salmany]

Sallam

"the armenian government and armenians in karabakh are oppressing Muslims of that region and we condemn the recent actions of karabakh armenians carried out with the support of the yerevan government,"

Ayatollah khamenei, also referring to the oppression of Muslims in bosnia-herzegovina and tajikistan, touched on the latest zionist attacks on civilian population of south lebanon and bombardment of mosques, villages and homes. the leader said that palestine and lebanon are symbols of the injustice and oppression of global arrogance.

Ignorance thrown one into ruin.

[Noor Ali]

Is it not hypocrisy that Khamenei ignores America but seeks to improve relations with Britain?  

Can you tell me why Iran is an ally with the sort of countries like Syria, who is responsible for the murder of 40,000 sunni Muslims, like Russia who is responsiblle for uncountable number of Murders against the Muslim people?

[pasdar1]

Salam un Alaykum,

Quote

Is it not hypocrisy that Khamenei ignores America but seeks to improve relations with Britain?

Can you prove this?  Prove that Ayatollah Khamenai wants to improve relations with Britain.


Iltemas e dua
Khodahafiz

[Noor Ali]

Can you tell me who  the supreme leader of Iran is?

[shabbir.hassanally]

In His Name, the Most High

Greetings Mr Noor Ali;

"Nice" to see you're back once again attempting to create fitneh and division amongst the ranks of the believers.  

"Nice" to see that once again you are working to discredit those who have done more for the true Islam of Muhammad(S), than you've had hot dinners.

"Very Nice"

Your statement:

Quote

Noor Ali said:
Is it not hypocrisy that Khamenei ignores America but seeks to improve relations with Britain?

Can you tell me why Iran is an ally with the sort of countries like Syria, who is responsible for the murder of 40,000 sunni Muslims, like Russia who is responsiblle for uncountable number of Murders against the Muslim people?

With the utmost of respect, I would once again like to advise you, that when you have no understanding of the real world, and when you lack the political acumen of a banana, it would be more prudent for you to remain silent.

Tell me, during the early days of Islam, the time of the Prophet(S), didn't the Prophet(S) make relation or at least try to talk and make some form of dialogue with all manner of different "empires"?

The Roman, the Persian, the Assyrian, the Byzantine, The Abbysinnian, et al?

Was the prophet then also a "hypocrit" (astaghfirullah!)?

When a country such as Islamic Iran, is placed in a situation as it is, where even the so-called Muslims - people with agendas much like yours my dear - are against Islamic Iran, the Righteous Islamic Leadership, must do something to strengthen itself, there are deals that are required to be made, not because those who have to make them like making them, but because they are required for the survival of Islamic Government.

Islamic Iran, has constantly condemned and has taken major issue with the Russians and others on their treatment of Muslims, you will be pleased to know that since Islamic Iran and Hizbullah made better relations with Syria, the treatment of the Muslims in Syria has improved exponentially, the same is with many other places.

There are reasons for what Islamic Iran does, there are reasons for the descisions of the Righteous Islamic Leadership, that you could not comprehend.

You must also remember, that when Imam ar-Ridha(A) accepted the Hier Apparency to Ma'mun ar-Rashid the Abbasid, there were many so-called lovers of the Imam, who prompted thought the Imam(A) had reneged on Islam, and those same people set about to attempt to kill him, and ultimately they conspired with Fadhl ibn Sahl and Ma'mun ar-Rashid to kill both the Imam(A).

This is again because they had two major issues:

1/ They didn't have loyalty to the Imam(A), which was complete and total, they had conditional loyalty - even though Imam ar-Ridha(A) was without a doubt an infallible, and from the Aimmah(A), they had loyalty as long as they could (with their small ignorant minds) understand the reasoning and actions of the Imam(A), if they didn't understand, they would go against the Imam(A), since they fundamentally didn't have belief in the concept of Imamah.

2/ They figured they knew better than the Imam(A), or rather better than the Righeous Islamic Leadership - the link to what is happening today is similar.

Allow me to explain if I may:

Islamic Iran is a bastion for Islam in today's world.  It is the vanguard of Islam, and does whatever is within it's power to safeguard the Muslims.

However, due to a number of reasons including the Global Economy - which sadly is out of Islamic Iran's control and forging a new economy and not working with other countries is not feasible, and would be utopian (hence the arguments placed by the sorely confused Hizb ut-Tahrir Organisation are - and have been proved previously by many people as unimplementable and utopian, since they make the mistaken assumption that an Islamic Government can survive without any relationship and dealings with others - since the others are "enemies".  But I am not here to discuss Hizb ut-Tahrir, that can happen some other time if the need is presented).

While it would be very nice if Islamic Iran could functional in a completely self-sufficient manner, however, that is something that is not practicle, insha Allah - if the Muslims realise the Truth, and overthrow their existing government, and the entire so-called Muslim World was to ally itself with Islamic Iran, it may be possible, but then there are other issues, such as Muslims outside and the "Muslim World", and their survival.

The issue is not as simple and straightforward as you suggest my dear, you have condemned Islamic Iran with a few lines, that you have read somewhere (or been fed by those who's agenda is nothing other than to serve the Dajjalikkk Empire - either knowingly or unknowingly), and you have without thinking decided that Islamic Iran is a terrible thing.

Without a doubt, there are things which are wrong with Islamic Iran, even the Government of the Prophet(S) and Imam Ali(A) had issues, every system is limited by it's lowest common denominator, every system.  This is one of the reasons why Allah is completely independent, and without need or partner, since that is the only way that absolute perfection can be attained.

Insha Allah you will reflect some and understand this.

With Regrets (that you insist on speaking when it is clear that your understanding is such areas is somewhat limited),

Shabbir

[salmany]

Sallam

Well said brother

[aghaji]

As salam alaikum

The Islamic Republic of Iran supports any muslim country who wishes to rid itself of the shackles of western hedgemoney.

Why do america britain saudia etc wish to infiltrate Iran and destabalise it through exiled followers of raza khan and the like.

Iran is dominant in its support for the palastinions and is uncompromising on its non acceptance of the state of isreal.

Iran is a fervent supporter of muslims in pakistan and india as any informed will tell you because they are anti "ROYAL FAMILIES" in the middle east they are targeted by all the capitalist lackies such as kuwait saudia jordan egypt.

Do not confuse the islamic ideolagy of Iran with the politics of the goverment these are in a power struggle with other pro western supporters this is why the attempts to sideline the spiritual leader and the ayatollas outside the control of khatami etc

[Noor Ali]

No need to get all emotional my love, Shabirhh.

Please tell me, do you really belive Russia and Syria are friends of Iran, or is that what you are made to belive?

You compared Iran's choose of Alies to that of our Holy prophet  pbuh , what a stupid mistake!

Dont you think the time has come for Iran to rethink about their choice of strategic allies?

As far as I know  the governments of Syria, Russia, Lebanon, and Sudan are considered Iran's strategic allies.

I will not now discuss Lebanon and Sudan, which owe Iran $400 million and evidently have no intention of paying up.

I want to ask only about Syria and Russia.

Since the beginning of the Islamic Revolution, Syria has benefited from Iran's broad support, materially, spiritually, and politically.

Nevertheless, in international conferences, it usually takes an anti-Iran position.

At the recent Beirut summit, not only did it express support for the UAE Council's demand regarding the three Iranian islands in the Persian Gulf, but also expressed opposition to the American attack on an Arab country i.e. Iraq, but not on a Muslim country i.e. leaving Iran open to attack.

That is, Syria implicitly supported an American attack on Iran instead of Iraq.

And Russia too is not living up to its commitments regarding the reactor in Bushehr, and thus wins concessions both from the West so it won't finish constructing the reactor and from Iran for promising to finish it.

In the Caspian Sea issue Russia even disclosed bilateral agreements with littoral countries abolishing Iran's portion of the Caspian Sea, and, by declaring military maneuvers, in effect proved that Russia has the last word in the Caspian region.

With "strategic allies" like these, does Iran really  need enemies?

[Noor Ali]

Sallam

Well said brother  

[pasdar1]

Salam un Alaykum,

Mashallah Brother, this was especially very nice {and true} as well:

Quote

every system is limited by it's lowest common denominator

May Allah guide all the the "lowest common denominators" in Iran and in the rest of the muslim Ummah, inshallah.

Quote

Sallam

Well said brother

Mr. Noorali, Don't bee too humble now.

Iltemas e dua
Khodahafiz

Edited by pasdar1, 04 October 2003 - 03:25 PM.

[Noor Ali]

Quote

Mr. Noorali,  , its funny that you complement yourself.

I was being sarcastic by comparing my self to Salmany, the tail of shabirhh.  <_<

[waiting]

This is politics and there is no coherency whatsoever.

Khamenei is Turk (Azeri), yet he supports Armenia, who in turn have the 2nd strongest mideast lobby in U.S. after the zionists, and is occupying 20% of Azerbaijan (illegally).

This is why government and religion must be separated.

[Noor Ali]

....... and to complete what bro waiting has said, Khameyni also sits back and watches the oppresion on Azeris of Iran. There has been many uprisings suppressed by his motor cycle riding fanatics.

[The Canuck]

Noor Ali:  You contradicted yourself again as you did in a topic you made before.  When countries are trying to co-operate and have dialogue it does not mean they hold the same exact views, and thus are termed "allies".

About Chechnya, this is where Iran and Russia have problems and they have voiced their concerns for the Chechnyan people constantly.

Waiting:  Stop speaking so ignorantly and making stupid judgements.

[salmany]

Mujahid: A fool makes foolish statements. Dont blame them.

[aZiZi]

waiting, on Oct 4 2003, 04:16 PM, said:

This is politics and there is no coherency whatsoever.

Khamenei is Turk (Azeri), yet he supports Armenia, who in turn have the 2nd strongest mideast lobby in U.S. after the zionists, and is occupying 20% of Azerbaijan (illegally).

This is why government and religion must be separated.

Armenia occupying Azerbaizan? They have an army now?

[Hannibal]

I'd have to agree with brother Waiting, Iran DID send tanks to Armenia to support them against azerbaijan.





Hezbullahi

[digi]

Quote

Can you tell me why Iran is an ally with the sort of countries like Syria, who is responsible for the murder of 40,000 sunni Muslims

You make it sound like there is religious oppression in Syria! There is only political oppression in Syria. The 40,000 sunni Muslim deaths at the hands of the government is exagerated, the figure is more like 20,000. This happened around 20 yrs ago when the brotherhood rebelled against the government in Hama, Assad then launched a merciless military attack on Hama killing around 20,000 sunni muslims. Sunnis, shias, alawites, christians, non of these are oprressed in syria. Anyway before Hafez Al-Assad when the sunnis were in power the shias, alawites and the christians were all oprressed! So Assad is more fair I say! Man I can't help it, I have great respect for Hafez Al-Assad, he was the master tactician of the middle east. While all disgusting arab states, and the majority of people in them supported the Iraqi attack against Iran, Assad used his brain and sided with Iran.  Assad begged sadamn to get out of kuwait in 1990 because he knew the consequences it would cause. Haha during the lebanese civil war Arafat wanted to visit damascus as a hero but Assad forced him out the country upon his arrival, what a great embarissment that musta been to arafat.

the good relations between Hafez Al Assad and Islamic Iran was due to both wanting the best for the region! Hafez Al Assad = probably the best arab leader of last century. Incidently it would be impossible for Iran to give equal precidence to all Islamic causes thus naturally it will aid some causes more than others. Anyway man, dont be foolish, Iran is the most generous "helper" when it comes to Islamic causes. Why did you have to pick the best "helper" to attack, why dont you attack the Saudi Arabian "Islamic State". Anyway if you so pro all these causes go empty your bank account and give it to the chechens.

Edited by digi, 04 October 2003 - 09:52 PM.

[The Canuck]

Bro Hizbullahi: Where is your proof that Iran sent tanks to and for Armenia? I don't think that is true at all.  It was Russia that was supplying Armenia.  There was an accusation that Russia sent supplys through Iranian terriroty, which Iran denied.  ( These area's are extremely close to each other ).  Russia has troops in Armenia and sends tanks and equipment there.  Iran did try to help resolve their conflict, and Iran did back Azarbaijan.


Also for bro waiting;  

Why didn't you also mention that Azarbaijan is a PRO-ISRAEL state, they are supported by ISRAEL and USA.  Another fact is how ISRAEL beams a dissident Azeri radio station into Iran.  The state rulers of Azarbaijan are not islamic, the president is a former KGB agent.  They are against the Islamic Republic.  Azeri's are almost all shia muslims, but they are trying to remove shia'ism from Azarbaijan.  

It is the state rulers of Azarbaijan, and the foreign forces influencing them, that's why they are pro-western puppets, and are powered by zionists for their own materialistic gains.  When USA tries to go for Iran next, they'll be coming from where ever they can Afghanistan, Iraq etc.  Azarbaijan is just something they'll use and use the people.

Your reasoning for why government and religion should separated is incorrect, because you leave out a lot of information.  

Salam.

[The Canuck]

http://www.durna.info/next.htm

Quote

Interestingly, the Pentagon, State Department, and Congress have been
meeting with Dr. Mahmud Ali Chehregani, the well-known Iranian
dissident who heads the South Azerbaijan National Awakening Movement
(cehreganli.com). Chehregani resides in the US. His group has offices
in Turkey and Azerbaijan and is one of several militant pan-Azeri
organizations, such as the South Azerbaijan National Liberation
Movement (camah.com) and the World Azerbaijanis Congress (azerbaijanis-
congress.com).

Clandestine Radio Watch, a widely respected research group, reports
that in the late 1990s, the Voice of Southern Azerbaijan--a dissident
Azeri station that was beamed into Iran--originated from Israel's
"Yavne transmitter site" and was likely "supervised and arranged by
Israel's intelligence agency: the Mossad."

Then there is Dr. Brenda Shaffer, research director of Harvard's
Caspian Studies Program, partly funded by the US-Azeri Chamber of
Commerce and major oil companies. In what one might imagine to be a
purely academic position, Shaffer has been a high-profile political
advocate for Azeris, writing and appearing frequently in the American
and international media.

Two years ago she asked Congress to lift long-standing US sanctions on
Azerbaijan. Dr. Shaffer also spoke before the nationalist, pan-Azeri
Vatan Society in Britain earlier this year.

Her recent book, Borders and Brethren: Iran and the Challenge of
Azerbaijani Identity, which touts Azeri identity and aspirations in
"south Azerbaijan," has, says US-based, Iranian analyst Afshin Molavi
"captivated the attention of [Iranian] regime change advocates in
Washington."

The American-born, Israeli-educated Shaffer has been a
"policy analyst" for Israel and served in the Israeli Defense Forces.

The Iranian Jewish Public Affairs Committee in California recently
disclosed that "there is a pact emerging between hawks in the [Bush]
administration, Jewish groups, and supporters of Reza [the late Shah's
exiled son] to push for regime change" in Iran. Reza has spoken in
front of the neo-con organizations AEI and JINSA, and the latter passed
a resolution last year urging "American support for Iranian
dissidents."